For NeptuneSuzy

[Moune]

:shock: No Cookie?

Oh shoot! Sorry Redlove. But I had my hands full of bottles. I couldn't carry more.  :oops:

Here's a cookie. And a muffin. And a jelly donut. I hope that makes you feel better.  :wink:

[missangelica]

I'm disappointed.  We could use a TSR informant because deity knows that they have enough of those here.  I was secretly hoping for Windkeeper because I hold this glimmering hope that she's not as bad as the rest of them and is just waiting for a time to bust out of that joint.

[RedLove]

Ditto Miss Angelica. I've always had the same feeling and I love her stuff. Has she even updated yet?

[Tchannie]

Well, I now know her site, but I haven't the foggiest about it--I've never heard of it before. Then again, I don't go in for building work; it's not my thing. But I wouldn't say she was famous in the conventional sense.

[Amazone]

Finally about the EULA argument. I, too, wish you would stop throwing that around all the time. I don’t completely buy it. There are a multitude of ways to interpret the EULA and just as many ways that the EULA interacts with copyright and intellectual property laws in different countries. I doubt if even the EA legal eagles have a clear-cut definition of whether paysites are illegal or not. In the end it would be up to a court to decide on the issue.

Well, suppose this is old now, from page 6, but i've seen this argument often. I've read some "horror"-stories from my own location, that means, the country i live in, about people who do not seem to care about EULAs. They can get in big troubble not reading the agreements they sign and accept. In fact, i think the pirates are doing the paysite-creators a favor
with warning them about the EULA. If you or anyone else "ignore" these
agreements, you never really know what is going to happen later.

My point is, do not take easy on EULA, the arguments to
PMBD are valid, and it's this site who shows respect for EAs EULA. They have nothing to loose, they can only win. Paysite-creators are in the opposite situation.

I am a highly responsible person and have moral values. So i have asked myself, 1. what am i doing wrong when i add some paysitecontent to the booty? 2. I have also asked myself what am i doing right?

After debating with myself and some friends who know the law, my answer on what i made morally wrong on question nr. 1 was no answer at all. Paysites lost my respect when they started to charge for their CC, adding paypals everywhere, and called it donations. (we all know what a donation means, hopefully). So why should i question my own moral or my fellow pirates moral towards people who 1. don't seem to have any troubble with their own etichs/moral? Do these people earn my respect?
No, they do not.

They have during several years violated EAs own rules, and still some try to rip of people's bankaccounts for creating some pixels, after reading free tutorials on MTS2 or similar sites.  Neither SimPE or wes_h plugins are for sale. The lessons on how to create was never for sale. I have bought a game, with all their EPs, and i have also read the EULA for bodyshop, for homecrafter and when you install the game.

I'll never stop using the EULA arguments, when all this is about is copyrights, and violation of copyrights. I know you are against paysites, and that is good, but lets say, you are a paysiteowner/creator. I bought CC from you and promised you not to share the files. I would not hesitate to break that promise.

Why?

Because if you owned a paysite, you've already broken your promises  to EA, and to me as a customer of EA, by violating their rules. As a paysiteowner you are creating more problems for my kids, and for  parents, the kids want all that glorious paysitecontent, many parents are SILLY enough paying for it, after they've bought the games, which means, the game is getting damm expensive after a while? SO WHAT OTHER RIGHTS DO WE HAVE IF NOT FOR EULA'S?  And heck, i bought it, i can't even get my money back if the stuff is horrible in game, i can throw it, if i am real evil i can of course share it with some people i don't like, but my moral would tell me that i just deleted it  since i don't want other people to get in troubble. That's just an example on debating morality/etichs. (Since my english is limited, i do not often write long stories about anything, but i had to say something about this).

And you have probably read this too?

Nouk have had a correspondance with EA, here are some of the answers

EAs response on usermade tools

Thank you for contacting Electronic Arts.

If the items and tools are used for your own personal use, then there is no copyright violation. If you start to distribute or sell items then it would be.

The items can be harmful and cause errors within the game, our first recommendation would be to remove any custom content. If you have any further questions or concerns
please reply to this email or visit our extensive knowledge base online at http://support.ea.com
Thank you,
Alex I.
EA Online Support


http://www.noukiesims2.net/Piccies/AboutTools2.gif

If one read EULAs the companies can give you $1000 as a gift for reading it. This post is not only for you.

I do not understand that you have a need for beeing anynomous at this site, as long as you do not share any files. I am not going to PM you just to know who you are, that is of no interest to me. I think pirates should be kinda careful who they start talking too, special people who are anonymous in the phorum, but want them to pm her. 100% freesite or not, one never know.......

[MIKEY]

EULA?  Oh, you mean that 'contract agreement' on software that often times you don't even get a button to click, let alone sign agreement to the 'EULA'.

Last I heard contractual agreements required signatures to be valid...

[Jaida]

What's with you guys and necromancy? This thread is almost a month old.

Um, no you don't Mikey. Now we have no problem with pay artists or fans trying to make an intelligent argument but you're not. Try again. :mrgreen:

[Zazazu]

EULA?  Oh, you mean that 'contract agreement' on software that often times you don't even get a button to click, let alone sign agreement to the 'EULA'.

Last I heard contractual agreements required signatures to be valid...

Dear, clicking "Next" is your agreement. In the case of the Sims2 and all EP and SP, you actually do have to click the "I Agree" radial button, then click "Next". Let's see...do you have all the EP? That means you have now agreed to the EULA six times. So don't give us that shit. If you want to make excuses, at least come up with some new interesting ones.

[Tchannie]

Last I heard contractual agreements required signatures to be valid...

Bollocks. You can have verbal contracts too--no signature. I don't see why this is any different. By clicking the "OK" or "I Agree" button, you agree to their EULA terms.

[MIKEY]

Wow!  You folks really ARE sheeples, aren't you?  Translate this!  On secone thought, I don't want to hurt your fragile minds and egos...


So basically, what I'm getting from you folks, is anything to justify theft and abandoning decent morality works for you.

[Bigtruckgirl]

Wow!  You folks really ARE sheeples, aren't you?  Translate this!  On secone thought, I don't want to hurt your fragile minds and egos...


So basically, what I'm getting from you folks, is anything to justify theft and abandoning decent morality works for you.

Mikey dear, you really are being a fuck nut, but I shall look at all your posts before I make my final decision.

[MIKEY]

[/QUOTE]Mikey dear, you really are being a fuck nut, but I shall look at all your posts   before I make my final decision. [/quote]

Honestly, folks;

I really hold nothing against you other than the fact that you think you are better than us.  I've actually enjoyed sparring with you all in here.  Much better than in S2C where they ban you as soon as your opinion becomes "too passionate".  LOL.  

If it wasn't for all the "PAYSITES MUST BE DESTROYED" sheeit, I think we could have lots of fun together!

[calalily]

Wow!  You folks really ARE sheeples, aren't you?  Translate this!  On secone thought, I don't want to hurt your fragile minds and egos...


So basically, what I'm getting from you folks, is anything to justify theft and abandoning decent morality works for you.

I'm not a sheep - I've actually thought deeply about this.  As a university ethics tutor in justice and law, I'm well versed on my personal morality, and what the technical terms for it are.  I can justify it under utilitarian ethics, nicomachean ethics and ethical egoism.  The only system that disallows it is deontological ethics, and I don't follow hardline religious ethics, so there's no conflict.

[MIKEY]

Wow!  You folks really ARE sheeples, aren't you?  Translate this!  On secone thought, I don't want to hurt your fragile minds and egos...


So basically, what I'm getting from you folks, is anything to justify theft and abandoning decent morality works for you.

I'm not a sheep - I've actually thought deeply about this.  As a university ethics tutor in justice and law, I'm well versed on my personal morality, and what the technical terms for it are.  I can justify it under utilitarian ethics, nicomachean ethics and ethical egoism.  The only system that disallows it is deontological ethics, and I don't follow hardline religious ethics, so there's no conflict.

And, surprisingly enough calalily, I'm not going to argue those facts with you, as you do strike me as well educated.

I will say though, that that being said, any frame of thought, belief, guiding mantra, or opinion can quantify and justify any direction for anyone that has the predilection or disposition suited to make those decisions for themselves.  Anyone with half a brain knows that. (no slight to any present intended) What is left is to determine who is 'right' and who is 'wrong'.  Throughout time, History has taught us, that the victor in the conflict ends up 'historically' right.  Now if it came down to those conditions, all that would tell us is one side was stronger and they won.  One would never really know if they were 'right' or 'wrong'.

In our case, if precedent is ever set, then it will decide.  However, we both know EA is too busy making money off of us to make the decision for the masses, so there are those that feel it necessary to make the decision for EA...

...and that is where I will stop on this topic tonight, as I think some progress in our relations may be possible at this juncture.  Maybe I'm wrong, but maybe not.

[calalily]

And, surprisingly enough calalily, I'm not going to argue those facts with you, as you do strike me as well educated.

I'm not better educated than a lot of people here - I just happen to do this for a job.  Here we have teachers, solicitors and a lot of people who have good educations.  This site is less open to sheeples - we're going against community mores - and sheep don't like that.

I will say though, that that being said, any frame of thought, belief, guiding mantra, or opinion can quantify and justify any direction for anyone that has the predilection or disposition suited to make those decisions for themselves.

 

That's ethical egoism.  Other systems of ethics such as utilitarian ethics and nicomachean ethics also support filesharing.

In our case, if precedent is ever set, then it will decide.  However, we both know EA is too busy making money off of us to make the decision for the masses, so there are those that feel it necessary to make the decision for EA...

I'm not making any decisions for EA - I'm making decisions for me.  They are a big corporation, and I don't care if they lose some money.  

But what I don't agree with is scalping people who legally buy files, and share them with others. What I don't agree with is the disparate standards that paysite owners seem to employ - that their time/effort/talent/bandwidth are worth more.  What I don't agree with is the fallacious argument that sims websites are only for rich people - which is ludicrous seeing as I have spent $3000+ on playing this game so far - and so none of us are in the gutter.