2 for u thieving off of Enayla

[Anouk]

I don't really see a problem if we have no proof whatsoever. What I see is 2 for u definately stealing her skintone.

[redisenchanted]

Hmmmm.

I don't know if she uses photos or not in her work. That's really not something I would be capable of judging. Seems to me though, that if what she did was easy, there would be lots of people doing it. Her work wouldn't stand out as unique. It is flat out spectacular and unlike anything I've seen elsewhere. Seems like the same person keeps bringing it up, like it's a personal crusade for him. That doesn't make it false, but clearly he has some kind of motive. I like Enayla/Linda, a lot of other people do too, so people take it personally when she is criticized.

Any similiarities between her sims 2 skins and Ren/Louis are quite speculative and probably result from using the same source photo. Louis used a commonly used artist reference photo. I really doubt that Enayla would use a copy (Ren's) when she had access to the original photo.

None of the above has any bearing on the fact that 2-for-you took her free skin, lightened it a bit causing pixelation and poorer quality, and is charging money for it. That is what this forum is about anyway. The other stuff is irrelevant.

[rickets]

For me I think it's laughable that she is complaining about someone stealing and selling her materials when she is using other photographer's copyrighted material to manufacture her work and earn a buck.

I decided to post one of the examples that Xeon_Black was using since there are so many links in play.



This was done in 2002 and she never acknowledged using a photo as a base.  What she said was that when she first started doing art she used photo references.  But this is the description of the piece that exists on Ballistic Publishing: " I started out on a dark brown canvas and doodled around until she started to pop out - at first the angle of the face and her expression, and then the shoulders, hip, and skirts."

Hypocrisy is an interesting thing.

[Jojoba]

That isn't proof that the sim skintones she makes are based on others, or copied from others.

[dr.philthy]

deleted

[Lilyroseisapirate]

me dont care we she gets or steals from, me wants skins from enayla! lol, seriously i dont know how they work their art, like pescado says it all looks the same to me, but i think her skins are pretty. and if she is stealing they are still very pretty skins!  :lol:

[Quinctia]

Well it doesn't take away from prettiness.  What people are saying is that it's a little hypocritical to copy a photo for art that you sell and then complain when people copy a picture of yours to sell.

Although I think the skin-stealing is a bit more direct theft.

[redisenchanted]

I'm unsure about her non-sim art. The evidence is mounting somewhat, so I have to consider it. The bench picture is pretty clear, but it is 5 years old. How she creates her pictures is not of much concern to me, but faking tutorials would be a bad thing. Sigh, I really hope that's wrong.

There is zero evidence she's stolen from other sims 2 creators though. I really doubt that. She wouldn't need to, she could easilly use a photo.

It's kind of like the poser hair rip-offs. I just don't care if XM sims does it, but when Peggy, Rose and Raon do it for profit, it makes me mad.

[Lourdes]

Ok so she saw a picture of a woman on a bench and created that painting of her woman on a very similar bench. The things I can see she painted over were the dress details and the bench. Both of which don't make that painting what it is nor do they demonstrate or distract from her obvious talent.

If she choses not to give out every single detail of how she created HER work thats her business.

And on the original topic yes her skins were stolen thats evident.

[Pineapplebrain]

I just don't see what the big fuss is. Maybe she painted over the original picture. Maybe she only referenced it. I don't know anything about graphic art. I do know a bit about other forms of art, though. However, I don't think what she did is all that relevant or even all that hypocritical. She took something that existed...modified it and made something completely new. 2-for-u took her skins, changed basically nothing and is now selling it.

If you look at this in a broad way...everyone samples. Nothing is original. Look at the music industry. Many of today's songs are just...recycled from previous decades. Sure, they may have gotten permission, but it still doesn't change the fact that they're "stealing", "borrowing," or "sampling." I mean, even Shakespeare didn't come up with too many original ideas. Many of his plays are redone versions of other people's plays. And he's considered a master of literature and theater.

[rickets]

But what about etiquette expert Ruth L. Kern?  How does she feel about having her body and bench appropriated for emo fantasy art?  Everyone has to think about poor Ruth! :lol:


http://www.modernetiquette.com/

[dr.philthy]

lol, Rickets!
I'm sure Ruth is very unimpressed. But her manners will prevent her from objecting too strenuously, I'm sure.

ETA-I've deleted all my other posts from this thread because in retrospect I beleive they were all irrelevant to this conversation.

[Tchannie]

Hmm...what's the proper etiquette for reacting when someone's stolen your picture...?

Not to say I don't love Linda's picture, and normally I hate art.

[silver]

We DO keep coming back to this, do we?

Perhaps I have been desensitized to modern creations, but many artists have used photos as a base for their art ... or been inspired by a photo ... or took a photo and embellished it in some way.

Here ya go. Recognize this artist?

http://webexhibits.org/colorart/marilyns.html

It doesn't make Warhol a lesser artist, or a non-artist. Some think his work is art, some think it garbage. I don't recall Warhol claiming it wasn't his art, or acting the least bit ashamed about it. Perhaps someone here has? I could be wrong.

In the music world? Oh, please. Rolling Stone once called The Beatles "the greatest borrowers in the world", and though a Beatlefreak myself, I acknowledge it. Sure they were! They borrowed from Chuck Berry, Buddy Holly, even Elvis. Sgt. Pepper was inspired by the Beach Boys' Smile. The song Being for the Benefit of Mr. Kite was taken almost word for word from an old circus poster. Lennon admitted it. But I don't recall any of them being ashamed or claiming,"Oh, we shouldn't claim this is our song!"

So many artists sample music now even more blatantly that I would be writing a book if I listed them. So I won't go into that.

Working off a picture, working off a riff ... it's really not uncommon in the arts. I'm surprised that anyone IS surprised. It may not be everyone's cup of tea, but it exists.

I've been seeing a rash of free-site artist or site-owner scrutiny that concerns me. It's not the mere mention of the alleged transgression that can be problematic ... it is what it is, I guess, and it's silly to hide it ... it's that much of this scrutiny winds up evolving ... can we call it evolving? ... into speculation and a "boil that dust speck" mentality. Should not most of our venom be reserved for sites who blatantly steal free-site ideas and sell these bastardized creations? Isn't this what this board is about? Shouldn't we pick our battles and targets just a bit more carefully?

Then again, I could be mistaken. Perhaps someone can enlighten me if I am.

[mohicantunes]

Hmm.. My first post here.

I thought this forum was about detroying paysites and the main reason Enayla is complaining is that they are selling out some skin she did, without giving any credits, and she is giving them for free.

Does it really mather she gives over-painted skins for free? Or based on photos or if she does it all by her self?

I actually don't believe that no one does it by it self. Everyone needs a base reference.

So much talking about her techniques and hipocrisy that you tottaly forgot that the main point here is about other selling stuff that are for free. Now that is hipocrisy.

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Post above. I agree... Most people here are picking on a fight on the wrong person. :/