Paysite or Simbella wannabe?

[Hecubus]

Some thoughts:

As far as I can tell, Elize's first language is English - she's in South Africa. My early 'pre-pirate' emails with her seemed very native in nature...but then, Gwendolyne is not a native English speaker, and her writing is nearly perfect, so who knows...

I don't think EA's contacted any of the paysites yet, but all of the recent discussion/emails/Nouk's letter/recent permissions to mention pmbd are making paysites nervous. They HAVE to know what's going on. That's why we're seeing statements come out like this one, and Peggy's. But no one's gone free because of it yet....so we still have work to do.

Maybe some of the Misguided (as I list them on my site) will choose to remove the pay items rather than put out statements like the silly one above.

<sigh>

[mando]

Some thoughts:

As far as I can tell, Elize's first language is English - she's in South Africa. My early 'pre-pirate' emails with her seemed very native in nature...but then, Gwendolyne is not a native English speaker, and her writing is nearly perfect, so who knows...

Ha, not sure if you were making reference to my statement or not. I wasn't referring to any specific website (although there are a few that would qualify), I was just adding on to the statement posted above mine.

*Plus, I was actually only referring to people who used an altavista type internet program as their main translator, not to those who are skilled enough to be able to write in more than one language. Just reread my post, and I think it might have been a bit confusing as to what I was referring to specifically.

*Edited to be a bit more clear

[tngrspacecadet]

hmm Elize is an Afrikaans name

[PsychoticMess]

Trust me, the ones translated into English are just as bad. I can understand, I guess, why people feel that they should translate stuff into other languages, but altavista or google or whatever will never, never translate anything into something comprehensible. Unless you're only translating something small (like one word translations of links in order to direct the user) there is no excuse for it.

Please do not translate your blog entries, or your terms of use, or anything even semi-complicated, unless you are good chums with someone who is willing to go through and correct the numerous mistakes those translators will make.

I love you.  

Seriously, thank you. That's exactly what I mean. It's great to want to translate something into another language, but you need a translator to do that. (Not even just someone who speaks the language, because that can give off results, too. Take Around the Sims 2, for example: from their translations, I can guess that they actually got someone who speaks French to write them, but not a professional translator, as their French sentences cling too closely to the English grammatical structure and sometimes sound awkward and unnatural. Sort of like some of my sentences in English, but the other way around. Hopefully not too many of them, though.) As for words, it's true that it can be okay to use a translator, if you don't have anything else. If, however, you own a dictionary (English/French, or whatever language), use it. Those online translators can give some pretty screwy results.

I'm not being fair, though. I don't think that the text on this site was translated online; it isn't that bad. I just think it was translated by someone with extremely basic knowledge of French, who should never have attempted to write anything that would later be read by francophones. 'Tis all.

[tngrspacecadet]

eek i just looked at the site. a minimum payment of 3.5€ for ONE SET?!?!111

that's a helluva lot of money. they must be mad.

and no way are those donations. other pages refer to "transactions"

and i agree, its a schoolgirly kind of translation. rather silly when its so easy to get something properly translated. even in sa...

i also see they try to get around the trademark thing with disclaimers. pathetically so.

[Doursim]

I've had 3 native french speakers translate my site for me, 1 spanish, and I did the german (lol yes I'm responsible for the poor german translation) but I have still had people send me letters telling me a sentence is wrong (mainly for the french translation) or whatever.  

On the same note:  I also get letters from people who appreciate the EFFORT to translate into a language that they can understand more easily than english.  I've been to a fair number of sites (mostly chinese or japanese) with rotten english translations, I mean... rotten!  But it's better than nothing.  If you're only there to download and not to read then it's not a big deal if every article is included, or every verb is correctly conjugated.  The beauty of language is that it is abstract forms/sounds that transfer an concrete idea from one person to another.  It's just a transaction of meaning, people who put too much faith in the rules and regulations of language are missing the point

[Rissa]

Take Around the Sims 2, for example: from their translations, I can guess that they actually got someone who speaks French to write them, but not a professional translator, as their French sentences cling too closely to the English grammatical structure and sometimes sound awkward and unnatural.

Well, Sandy is French. From her Contacts info:

Code:

I'm french. I tell this for the french people who begin their mails by "Excuse my english, I'm french"... (And so I am! ;)), and for all the english native locutors who use "u" instead or "you", "r" for "are", etc, etc... I'm sorry, but... when they're too many, I just don't understand anything and I don't answer. Please, please, don't forget that english is NOT my language! Thanks!

[PsychoticMess]

...If it seemed like I was just being picky, that isn't the case. It's just really obvious that this person had no clue how to speak proper French. The word "récever," for example, does not, never has and never will exist. I'm not complaining about a misplaced comma or a misunderstood nuance. I'm complaining about freaking imaginary words. I think they meant "recevoir."

I've had 3 native french speakers translate my site for me, 1 spanish, and I did the german (lol yes I'm responsible for the poor german translation) but I have still had people send me letters telling me a sentence is wrong (mainly for the french translation) or whatever.

Hmm, then again, francophones either butcher the language or act really anal about it, so I guess I fall into the latter category. Sorry. As much as I appreciate the effort, I believe that all translations should be performed by someone at least remotely competent, and with a solid knowledge of the language that the text is being translated into. If it comforts you, though, I think the same about translations toward English and any other language. Not just French. ^_^

Edited, because this was posted while I was responding:

Well, Sandy is French.

That would be me being anal, but despite this, some of her sentences really are awkward. Most of them are alright, and it's obvious that she speaks French, but some of them sound weird--I think what's causing that is all the Sims terms. They make her sentences sound bad sometimes. The sentence structure is the only issue, though. Her French is otherwise very good, so I don't doubt that she speaks it as a first language--I mean, very honestly, I'm pretty sure Sims terms would screw me over, too. I've just never tried.

Also, she uses French terms from France, so they might have seemed unnatural to me and biased my opinion. I am from Quebec, after all, so French from France will always seem weird and awkward to me.  :wink: Much in the way that (and this is one of the major issues that I had with the French on Around the Sims 2) I would never say "donation" in French. It should be "don." A "donation" is a legal term in French, and no one ever uses it in every day speak, so Sandy must have been pretty heavily influenced by English paysites to use it.

[SoggyFox]

I don't mind reading a translation from other languages into mine - because usually the result is charming and/or amusing, and again, the courtesy is very much appreciated.

And the reverse is true, if in my attempt to write something out in another language amuses and or strikes the reader as charming, then I won't be offended at all.

Of course, I'm so rusty with the languages I know at a very basic level, that its not very likely I'll be translating from my native anytime soon.

And there are alot of non-native speakers that seem to speak english better then me, too

[MissBlondie]

PsychoticMess I soo agree with you, I am very picky on french but some pay sites, have some ackward translation.
I wouldn't say anything for a free site because french is hard, but because it is pay, they should make the effort [Sasilia forgot the P to comptoir in her last set comptoir des épices]. On of the funiest is rose, the french is so bad (german also, even I would do better) that I read the english thread.

For Sandy the french she is using doesn't seems natural to me either (and I am from France). It seems like english translated into french.

[missangelica]

What if Sandy is only saying she's French as part of an online persona?  'cause, you know, people never lie on the internet..  :roll:

[MissBlondie]

What if Sandy is only saying she's French as part of an online persona?  'cause, you know, people never lie on the internet..  :roll:

Her french is very good, the constructions are typicaly french, the vocabulary doesn't seems very natural to me, but her grammar is almost perfect (maybe a few things to say about where she puts her commas but still). And beeing around english natives learning french all day, she doesn't do the normal mistakes you expect from an english person.

Plus, around the sims is one of the onliest sites where the creator takes time to translate all of her stuff in french, why do that (even french creators like lessons about look and purple juice don't do it) if you aren't french ??

[missangelica]

Why does anyone do anything?  If she's going to claim to be French, why would she *not* have some french on her site?  Wouldn't that look a little suspicious?  (She probably is French.  I'm just joking around.)

Even though I speak only english I have every intention into making my site readable in several languages with help.  Why do I want to?  To make the site more accessible and a slight poke at those that think english sim users demand non-english sites to have english translations but won't do the same.  I think it's more of inability to than willfully refusing.  It's unfortunate that there is more of a push to learn english than there is for other languages.  I've known people that have taken four years of a language and not remember a thing shortly after.

[mando]

I think there is a major difference between going to the effort of translating your page into another language and checking to make sure it's fairly accurate and just dumping your page into an online translator and going "Meh, it's probably good enough".

Oftentimes I find that pages dumped entirely into online translators become almost nonsensical, and trying to work my way around them is just as difficult as it would be in only the creator's first language. For smaller things, like links or even short important mesages, it is fine, but I think it's basically pointless to use them to translate anything that requires appropriate language (especially for pages for business use *coughpaysitescough*).

Although I will admit to being a bit (okay really) fussy about grammar and spelling, so I have a bit of a bias. I die a little inside everytime I see someone misuse loose, their or your.

[missangelica]

Language is made even more difficult by different cultures using one language differently.. Mexican spanish is not the same as Spanish spanish.  Quebec french is not the same as French french.  American english is not the same as English english.  

Text only makes it even more difficult as we can't see the person's face and body and the sound of their voice.. Meh, we can only do our best and hope the idea gets across.

---

What I can't get past is the misuse of "defiantly" when they actually mean "definitely."  Defiantly is actually another word!  

I need a swing of rum.