Your Prettiest Freesite Creation Find: Round Two (Apparently)

[Realmscat]

Apparently I am having issues with posting so please bare with me. If this comes up later more then once please be so kind as to delete them. Anyways.."laughs" More then likely you will not win, yet you continue to fight. Also on course I found this at Black Pearl.
http://www.blackpearlsims.com/showthread.php?p=436799#post436799

[ferncapel]

Actually, Ferncapel, you said there was no language here until the british got here.  It might not have been what you meant, but its what your said.

And I spent the weekend up in Cherokee North Carolina.  The signs and everything are dual lingual - english and cherokee.  Pretty looking language.  And since the town -is- the reservation, alot of the businesses were run by Cherokee too.  I tried to avoid the touristy shops and hit only the ones selling actual native crafted stuff - it was not at all easy, but I got some really nice things - a white fox dreamcatcher made from wood, sinew fur and feathers, and a doeskin [I'm pretty sure anyway] bag in white with a turquoise button.  I got one of them with my winnings from the casino, since I was determined to leave the money -there-.

Seriously though, while other languages are spoken here, English is the official language of the US - it might change, but it is now.

And as I understood it, Wales was forced to abandon their language [legally anyway] by the Welsh....unless my reading is off, the Tudors were welsh nobles before ruling england - and when they took the throne, they took away Welsh as a language [ not that they succeeded ]

Soggyfox...i did not say there was no language until the British got here...i suggest (nicely)that you read back. I said you had no official language, a point thats been repeated by other members on this thread. Its pretty obvious you had languages before Europe colonised you because you already had native Americans and and many other tribes. I said you had no official language...if you can find where i said you had no other language before the British came...then quote me. Because i can not remember saying that and can not find it reading back. If you find it...i'll hold my hands up and apologise.

As for your visit to Cherokee, North Carolina...i bet it was a fantastic trip. I admire the past and present Native Americans for keeping hold of their culture and traditions and lifestyles after 'we' colonist tried so hard to  (wrongfully) change them and even eradicate them. It ccould not have been easy. I hope they continue to hold on to their culture as so many others are being wiped out.

Realmscat, i totally agree with you. Too much is destroyed, and were all too blame in one way or another and at some point in history. That is why we should try to keep hold of what cultures and traditions we can.

Back on topic, that bathroom is very nice, great detailing.

[kenmtl]

Interesting choice of words "pervert the language to their desires". Nothing to do with you Realmscat just picking up on that. I've always found that expression fallacious because of it's derogatory connotation. I know it's not always true but the word perversion generally carries that weight. I think pliability is essential to the vitality of any language. Culture is a dynamic entity and in a constant state of flux. Language as a form of expression needs to adjust itself accordingly or it becomes redundant and useless. It's one thing to respect a language's heritage and uniqueness and to preserve it's integrity. However restricting it's ability to adapt and strangling it with outdated cultural idioms is it's death knell. The greatest strength of the English language and probably the sole reason for it's existence today is that it's a linguistic sponge. It takes whatever it needs at the moment and incorporates it. Always has and always will. That's it's thang, making itself relevant. That's why it's such a great language. You can twist it and turn and shape it and kick it in the balls, but it will always adapt. I love using English for exactly that reason. Any language that's not ready or willing to do that will eventually fade away because it'll no longer be useful or relevant.

Anyway, MOAR FREE STUFZ!!

[Anyerfillag]

Anyerfillag
No saying i am British therefore i am English does not equate British as English. English is England's native language, we all in Britain have our native languages even if they are no longer our first language.  Scotland, Wales and Ireland are English speaking but its not your native language. To be honest, don't balme the British for beating your native language out off you. You could revive your own language if you wanted to...thats your choice!

Also as a nation i can honestly say that ive never noticed that we spell things differently. Say things differently only because of the tones of our accents, but not spelll. Ive never come across words spelt differently anywhere in the country, only words spelt incorrectly. I'd like a few examples of that how different regions here in the U.K spell words differently. Come on...educate me!

You did it again! British does not equal English! If I were to blame the British I would be blaming my own home country (Scotland) that did no wrong If you're British, you're British. If you're English, you're English. Being British includes every country within Britain; are you half English and half something else?

I will admit I got the spelling part wrong.

The Irish and the Scottish weren't just convinced to give up their language, they could be killed for using it.  It took brave people to make it so those languages didn't die.  The same with many Native American dialects.  Some are completely gone, but others were saved by people willing to risk their lives to keep speaking it, and to teach it to others. 

When you take away someone's language, it's not just the language, it's taking away a part of them.  How would you feel if someone came to you and said, "Nope, you're not allowed to speak English.  If you do, we'll kill you.  Oh and your religion?  WRONG, you can only worship our God, the one true God.  And while we're at it, that Internet you go on?  No more.  We don't believe in the internet. And let's take away any other hobbies you might enjoy, they aren't what we consider to be appropriate hobbies.  And your land?  It's not yours anymore either, it's ours.  You can't have land until you worship our God and become just like us."  How would you feel if they destroyed your culture?  Forbid you from telling any stories of your family and your people?  Forbid you to read books written by writers of your nationality? Forbid you to sing the songs of your people?

THIS! You can have my unborn child for this! I try explaining this to people who have the same response and just don't understand how cruel the English where to the rest of the UK when it came to culture and language, and then Britain were towards the Native Americans.

[Realmscat]

I can't say as I disagree with you kenmtl. Perversion was the only word at that moment I could come up with to explain basicly what you said.  No worries either, I seldom take what others say personally. Unless of course it is directed to me specificly. Like realmscat your a bitch.."LOL" I can't assume their is any malice in what anyone types unless it is clearly stated.

Oddly I found this hair quite cute actually, and there is never enough male hair for me.

http://www.digitalperversion.net/gardenofshadows/index.php?topic=12036.0

[ferncapel]

Just to clarify what i originally said... I know British does not equal English, that is so obvious! As being English is part of being British, it makes my statement, the use of 'therefore', true. It doesn't stae that British equates English at all and does not mean that English is the only consequence of being British. There are other consequences of being British and they are Irish, Welsh and Scottish. But i did not need to include them in my statement because i was also refering to the English language!

Also that was a genuine mistake that i used British where you've highlighted it, it should say English. I hold my hands up to that one. I apologise.

Also i'm 100% English...well at least that i know of!

Also i admit the English were cruel to the Scottish people, as they were to the Native Americans. I've never condoned our behaviour in any of these. I believe we were wrong through and through and i also agree and understand what Dargstar said, as if you'd read back you'd know. So i'm uncertain to what same response you are refering to. I was talking about your language only and your statement that we beat it out of you is what i replied to. I never disagreed with you.

Darqstar
Also the Gaelic language is not an almost dead language , its still used, though not everday, in certain parts of Scotland. It is in the decline due to the lack of need to use the language. Also Scotland has attempted to reverse the decline of the language with limited successs, but in some schools it is taught. Also the Scottish Government is working to promote the language in the media. So it can be done, and credit where credits due, they are working to maintain the language. I understand doing this is a long slow battle and can seem a losing battle So for an individual, trying to learn it just for themselves it would be time consuming when people have such busy lives so i do not think anyone is lazy for not trying...but for those with the time and want to learn, there are courses and groups that teach the language.


Anyerfillag

You've yet to give me examples of different spellings of words from one region to another in the U.K. I seriousley want to know as i have honestly never come across this before. I work inthe Tourist Industry for the U.K so encounter many people from all over the U.K and have never witnessed this. I even asked a few lovely individuals (from different regions) that i met today during work and they hadn't seen this either! So as your are the one with the knowledge on it, as ive said, educate me!

[Anyerfillag]

I said in my post 'I admit I got the spelling part wrong' Ferncapel Also, I am not the fountain of knowledge, I do not know everything and if I ever say I do then I am lying through my teeth.

You said that I can't blame anyone, and could quite easily learn my native language. I have heard that from other people who I have had this same discussion with, so thats why I said that.

[ferncapel]

Oooh! Apologies...hadn't realised that when you said about the spelling part that you were refering to what you had said about regions!...i though it was about the bit you highlighted in black. Duh! Just realised that was my typo! Sorry...forget about it then! I know youre not the fountain of knowledge! as i was only asking about one topic! None of us are!

[Eskimo Pie]

 *claps and screams wildly* Yay! More short hair for men!!!

 And I am loving the build set, I already have the bathroom and is sitting pretty in a few of my homes.  I went from having over 50 thousand downloads to over 30. I must resist the clicky button!

[Ashbashtus]

Im so NOMing that male hair when I finally get rid of dial-up tommorrow. . As for the language debate going on here, living in Massachusetts, I get accused of murdering the English language with my lack of "R's" at least once a day so I'm not too offended. However, like Darqstar, I hate the notion that the America was desolate and empty before the colonies came here. Its ignorant and cold. I'm not accusing anyone here of saying that, I'm just stating an opinion.

[cookiepirate]

All if this started because of a post with some ...'s?  Who knew that ...'s could have such power!  Bowing to the wondrousness of the mighty ...'s

[ferncapel]

They are amazing aren't they? So full of power..we should start a cult to them and start wprshipping at the mighty altar of the ...'s

[falln_angel]

Just to clarify what i originally said... I know British does not equal English, that is so obvious! As being English is part of being British, it makes my statement, the use of 'therefore', true. It doesn't stae that British equates English at all and does not mean that English is the only consequence of being British.

I don't want to start a thing here, but you did actually say that British equals English even if it was unintentional. Your original statement was:

I'm British, therefore i am English.

The only way to interpret that statement is to mean all British people are English.

This might be a bit clearer with an unrelated example:

"I am human, therefore I am a mammal."
vs.
"I am a mammal, therefore I am human."

The first sentence indicates that all humans are mammals, which is true. The second indicates that all mammals are human, which is definitely not true.

Again, I'm not trying to pick a fight here, and I'm certainly not trying to be the Grammar Ploice, but this is one of those cases where improper usage completely changes your meaning so I thought I'd point it out.

[ferncapel]

Cheers! Have a bottle of rum on me!

[Darqstar]

Darqstar
Also the Gaelic language is not an almost dead language , its still used, though not everday, in certain parts of Scotland. It is in the decline due to the lack of need to use the language. Also Scotland has attempted to reverse the decline of the language with limited successs, but in some schools it is taught. Also the Scottish Government is working to promote the language in the media. So it can be done, and credit where credits due, they are working to maintain the language. I understand doing this is a long slow battle and can seem a losing battle So for an individual, trying to learn it just for themselves it would be time consuming when people have such busy lives so i do not think anyone is lazy for not trying...but for those with the time and want to learn, there are courses and groups that teach the language.

Now it's coming down to nitpicking and it's better off just put aside.  The world "almost" might mean one thing to me, and another to you.  A dead language is pretty easy to define.  Although, I have people who argue to me that you can't even call Latin a "dead" language, because it's still taught. 

By "Almost dead" I mean that it is a language that is almost never, if ever, the only language of a people, or a first language.  It's not, as far as I know.  It's a dual language, it might be taught in schools, but as far as I know, there aren't communities where children learn it as their first language because that's what their parents grew up knowing, so on and so forth.  There might be a deliberate effort to revive it, but by my personal definition, it's an almost dead language.  For a village/town/area to raise their children to speak it as their first language, the parents would have to know it as a second language, and then make a deliberate effort to not speak their first language, but to only speak Gallic so their children would learn it first and only, until taught another. 

And again, I might have misunderstood, but the comment came across like, "if you're not living in a country where everyone speaks their original native dialog, it's YOUR fault and you can't blame anyone else."  And that's just not true.

People like to think that it happened a million years ago, but the last residential school in Canada only closed down in the 1980's. I think 1984 to be exact. My father had sisters taken away never to be seen or heard from again. When I went to high school it was a church school who made us speak french only and made fun of our faith and culture. And even tho I am Canadian, I get told by strangers here in nova scotia to speak English or get out of "their" country. Just on Sunday I was on the bus speaking my native to my young son and I was told by 2 old men that I should go back to my country and that "foreigners" like me take all the jobs. Idiots had no clue.
 I do not hate all white people, I hate the government for covering up history and not educating people. anyways that is enough heavy thinking for me today lol

I understand that this is not ancient history by any means.  When I was born, there were still parts of the country where white people had to have their own bathrooms and water fountains because they couldn't risk using the same toilet that a person who wasn't white might have used.  I think it's actually a credit to how far we've come that the whole concept of being unable to stand the idea of sharing a sink or a bathroom with someone who isn't white, just is something I cannot wrap my head around, nor can most people I know. 

I just think that it doesn't do much good to continually beat ourselves up over it.  At this point, the past cannot be changed, the best that can be done is to go forward and try to make sure nothing like this ever happens again. 

THIS! You can have my unborn child for this! I try explaining this to people who have the same response and just don't understand how cruel the English where to the rest of the UK when it came to culture and language, and then Britain were towards the Native Americans.

No children, unborn or not.  However, were you to offer me a kitten, I'd find it hard to resist.