More Smutty Than You: TSR's Hall of Shame

[EmilyTwitch]

It seems to me with teen-flick horror films like Prom Night and SAW, this dress isn't really out of the norm. The kids at my school er, the local high school see worse in health class when watching films about gang wars and safety stuff. Last year there was a film that showed rather graphic stab wounds inflicted by rival gangs.

Ah the joys of living in California. 

But, I guess a younger kid might be freaked out. Why would a younger kid be playing the sims, though? If it's rated T for Teen, it's not quite good parenting to let a younger child play the game and surf the internet to download things.

[deelink]

The reason why its called "Becky's Dress" was because it was a Halloween outfit Becky Connor wore (from the Roseanne show).
I don't think you guys need to worry about it too much. It does say that it is for Halloween.

I would be worried if the dress was called "Rape Victim" or "My First Prom Date" or something like that. But then again, I am not a child and when I was a child, I would not have batted an eyelid on that.

[dietofworms]

Right.  And we want our little girls to dress up in bloody costumes.   Doesn't matter what it's called, it's bad enough.

I reported it, big deal I know.  They'll ignore it like they ignore any criticism.

[Pixel]

The costume isnt for little girls its for adults. And it clearly says its halloween.PG 13 these days isnt the same as it was when i was 13 and 14 ( im 23). I do think TSR goes to far though, i dont think that costume is a big deal. Its their other items that are, like those nasty child hooker type clothes. Thats very wrong, and them selling recolors of maxis items. Well i reported that the other day to maxis themselves, including links to items and a lengthy email about them needing to step up and take action over this bs at tsr.

[deelink]

Right.  And we want our little girls to dress up in bloody costumes.   Doesn't matter what it's called, it's bad enough.

I reported it, big deal I know.  They'll ignore it like they ignore any criticism.

Well not to nit pick. But it's for teenagers. Last I heard teenagers love horror movies. But yeah, I guess it's a little distasteful. Like Roseanne the show was... a little distasteful, but still fun

[Devilfish]

It seems to me with teen-flick horror films like Prom Night and SAW, this dress isn't really out of the norm. The kids at my school er, the local high school see worse in health class when watching films about gang wars and safety stuff. Last year there was a film that showed rather graphic stab wounds inflicted by rival gangs.

So... Wait, your school thinks exposing kids to images of gore and brutal violence is a spiffy idea so long as there's someone saying "Kids, see that shit? Don't do that shit." Weirdest take on education ever.

The costume isnt for little girls its for adults. And it clearly says its halloween.PG 13 these days isnt the same as it was when i was 13 and 14 ( im 23). I do think TSR goes to far though, i dont think that costume is a big deal. Its their other items that are, like those nasty child hooker type clothes. Thats very wrong, and them selling recolors of maxis items. Well i reported that the other day to maxis themselves, including links to items and a lengthy email about them needing to step up and take action over this bs at tsr.

The hell? Whe I think halloween (which, incidently, we don't celebrate in my country, so I could be way off) I think funny pumpkins, kids with sheets over their heads and crappy Joker costumes. When did spilling the guts of the innocent become PG13? By that logic, you could slap 'Halloween special!' on a chainsaw and give it to a minor. Oh, the gory innocent fun that will surely ensue!

[deelink]

You can't patrol kids forever, sooner or later they are going to see the gore. It's up to the responsible parental figure involved, to teach them about consequence.

The spilling of guts become PG 13? It's not. It never was. That outfit is pixels, the original was prosthetic because it was a COSTUME.  I think you guys are totally blowing it out of porportion.
If a child goes to TSR there are FAR worse examples than this. I am not defending TSR, I am just saying it's hard to get your back hard up, when we are talking about a costume, a bit of fun. It's not real, it never pretended to be.

Plus, look at the Dark Knight Returns movie, that was PG. And do you see little kids going up to other kids, positioning them over a pencil and going BAM! Dead child? No. It's a MOVIE and the Joker was clearly portrayed as a bad guy, because funnily enough, he's the villain!

Well in the end, perhaps noone is really getting what I am saying because I don't have kids, so I don't have that protective urge or something. So it's coming out really cold. Oh well. 

[Beth]

Ok, maybe I was overreacting, and maybe it may just be a costume for halloween, but when I do eventually have children (which is v soon) I don;t want them to see stuff like that.
Your childhood is very precious, and even if you can't keep tabs on them constantly, you still want to give them a good life and keep them away from bad.
Like I said there's enough bad things going on on this plaet this past few, eg violence, war, and even if something like that costume is only a small thing, having that on a popular site for kids (The Sims 2 may be T for teens, but I know of a lot of 7 year olds that play it, woohoo and all) is making that look like something good.
I'm confusing myself here, but what I'm trying to say is even if us pirates don;t trust TSR, it's one of them sites where a lot of children go on, because of the age "certificate" and a lot of parents trust that site for their kids to go on, so something like that showing up to a kid isn't really a good message.

Get me?

[Devilfish]

I don't have kids either, so we've got that much in common. The main thing I'm objecting to is the fact that TSR clings to that PG13 shite like a drowning man to a buoy. The hypocrisy is staggering.

That being said, clear something up for me: PG13 basically means it's okay for kids 13 and older, right? No, you can't patrol kids forever, but 13 is far from forever. I'm still grateful to my mom for sitting down and watching Sleepy Hollow before I did and telling me I couldn't watch it. That movie was great fun when I was 16, but it would have damn near traumatised me when I was 12. I'm happy my mom (and some other people too) took some control over what I saw.
I was exposed to pretty hardcore pr0n at a very young age over a long period of time, way before I could understand what it was or even what those people were doing, mainly because my parents were new to the internet and didn't realise what was on there. I'm still having sexual problems this day because of it. So the argument that kids can handle that stuff doesn't fly in my opinion, because they're extremely vulnarable. I used the sex example because it comes from personal experience, but it goes for gore and violence as well.

So sure, parents should be the ones watching out for their brood. That doesn't mean the responsibility of the community went poof. An dhey, that community? That's you and me.

[deelink]

Alright, point taken. A 13 year old kid is not going to see the difference between a costume and real life. And a kid is not going to understand the difference between the Sims and real life.

In fact we must censor everything a child sees, because otherwise we are not responsible people. As long as the child is under your care, one must ensure that they are guarding them, and filtering content for them.
Because a child, even if you explain the difference between reality and fiction, is not going to see the difference. And to explain consequence to them? Pish Posh! That's giving them more intellectual merit than they deserve, right?

So... till the child turns 16 or whatever age it is nowadays, it should not dress up in anything obscene for Halloween, and sites like TSR should not condone such violent images to be left for children to see.

I don't know guys, like I said. Perhaps I live my life in an environment filled with hyper reality. And the kids I know are not as naive as they once were. Ah oh well Bedtime now for me!

[Devilfish]

No. We must assume they're going to see a lot of bad things no matter what. At friends' houses, on tv, on the internet and in the newspaper, and we must accept that some things cannot be changed. That doesn't mean we should let our kids see whatever they want and can. My stance is, accept that they'll see bad things and put it in a proper context, prevent them from seeing it when you can.

I can't and won't stop kids from watching the news and learning about the disgusting things that hapen all around them. Because that's reality and I cn't change that.  It's constructive. At least I can teach them that while the world is in a bad way, there's things we can do. It's positive parental guidance.
Obviously, in the case of that picture, we can prevent children from seeing that. And I would, because it will teach them nothing besides the fact that gore and violence re normal things to see for a young child. There's no way to attach a positive message to any of these pictures. Not a message I want them to learn.

Parental guidance is not the same as zero-tolerance and nobody should be confusing the two. I actually prefer children to learn about these things and I fully accept they'll learn about the most horrible things before they even reach pubrty. But I'd like for that to happen in a controlled environment where I'm there to put things in their proper context, thank you very much.

There is a middle ground between sheltered little pale pod-children and unmonitored pr0n-surfing hooligans you know. Don't make it sound like we have those two to pick from.

[HugeLunatic]

That costume fits with what it is supposed to be.  Shouldn't really be in the smutty category.  It's a costume! The game is Teen, PG-13.  That means if the parent doesn't want there child exposed to "teen" things then they shouldn't buy the game for them!  It is the parents responsibility.  My kids play age appropriate games, and that is defined by  me.  Same with movies.  I either play the games myself to see them, or watch the movies.  I don't trust any rating system.  PG-13 used to be, way back, could not use "Fuck" in the movie.  Now?  They use it 3-4 times and that is still considered PG-13.  There are things my teens are exposed to now that I don't like, but it seems to be the way society is evolving.  So I have to address that and make sure my kids understand things, whats right/wrong and what is acceptable/unacceptable.

[neriana]

Well, I think a lot of the sexy costumes on TSR define what they're supposed to be just fine, and that still doesn't make them appropriate for a "won't somebody think of the children!" site. Frankly, I don't give a fuck if children have completely naked Sims in their games, but I am disturbed by the violence. But neither fits TSR's supposed policy.

[deelink]

Devilfish, I don't understand what you are saying, because it seems you not listening to the CASE at hand.
TSR are irresponsible for showing blood and gore. On a costume. For Teens. <-- That is your argument.
MY argument is, it's Halloween season, and portraying Halloween costumes from a PG 13 program  (Roseanne) is fine, because I am going to give teenagers the benefit of the doubt and believe they understand the difference between costumes and real life. The Sims 2 and Real Life.

My BF said that it was pretty sick, and other people could use it in-game in ways that it shouldn't be used. Ways that could be damaging or perverted. When I said "Do you think a kid is going to be traumatised by it?" he just said "No. It's a game, a kid is going to see that as a costume, but it could still be used in wrong situations within the game"

Devilfish you are very aggressive on this issue, when all I wanted was to make some points known and to have a discussion. I don't believe in cottoning children, not pushing their face into horror. I hope you didn't think that was what I was condoning. But the fact remains that we live in a very media saturated society, and like you said, you cannot blindfold children forever and like I said the best defence to help your children is teaching them about consequence. It's like we are arguing on having the same viewpoint, exept you want to brutalise TSR, while I think there are far worse examples, however this is still going in the fodder. So let's toast some marshmellows.

[Devilfish]

It just looks like we're talking different subjects now. If it helps, I do see where you're coming from but I'm having trouble making my point in English, since it's not very different from yours. I do think I understand what you're trying to say though and think our views on the subject differ only slightly. It requires a lot of concentration to express all that in another language. Trust me, if I got to say al this in Dutch I'd be so eloquent you'd weep. 

If I sounded agressive, I apologise. I meant to sound... firm, I guess. Didn't mean to attack you or your views, just make mine clear as best as I could. I guess I was talking about the big picture while you were talking about that one screenshot? I just drifted off from the original topic and went blabbing about my views on child-rearing. I don't know, but I'm willing to blame it on miscommunication. Just... I don't know if you did, but don't assume I think kids are stupid or fragile. The reason I feel so strongly about this topic is because I respect them so much. If I can help a kid out in any way, I will.

TSR are irresponsible for showing blood and gore. On a costume. For Teens. <-- That is your argument.

Close, but not quite. TSR are hypocrites for showing blood and gore. I have to agree with neriana on this: you can slap any label you want on it, whether it's one of those smutty teen whore outfits or this one, but that still doesn't make it appropriate. The fact that the label Halloween or Costume is attached to this one doesn't change the fact that someone may be shocked to see it, like I was.
Just to make it clear: no, I don't think anyone will get scarred for life over this picture. At all. If this had been on any other site I still would've found it distasteful but probably wouldn't have complained so loudly. Partly because this is TSR and I do bear a grudge, true, but also because the site that hosts this creation is very agressive about their rating, attacking anyone who challenges it. In fact, this whole thread is about how they're being hypocrites for doing  just that and I don't think that stops at smut.

That's a clear as I'm ever going to get it, and I know it still sounds muddy. If this isn't enough, I'm afraid we're going to have to agree to disagree.

And yes, marshmellows sound good