PMBD

Here is the response I got back from EA when I asked if it was OK to sell my custom content. (She sounds a little peeved.)

Some websites are violating the End User License Agreement by selling items m...
 
  Discussion Thread
 Response (GM Spada) 05/24/2007 07:31 AM  
Hello,
    Thank you for taking the time to contact us about your incident. Your concerns are very important to us. This is against the Sims 2 EULA and in violation of US Copyright law. In doing so you may open yourself up to litigation. As to any sites "selling" custom content for the Sims 2, we continue to investigate several of these sites to verify if there are any violations of Copyright law taking place. Thank you for sending in your question and your concerns, but rest assured we are fully aware of these sites. Should you have any further questions or troubles, please just let me know.

Sincerely,
Spada
Customer Support Supervisor
Electronic Arts
 
 Customer 05/23/2007 07:42 AM  
Some websites are violating the End User License Agreement by selling items made with The Sims 2 Homecrafter and BodyShop. The EULA says that you cannot sell these items. Can I sell my items that I made for the game using Homecrafter and BodyShop? (This is my original question)

lol, and these paysites SWEAR that arent doing anything wrong and EA is okay with what they are doing. friggin email that thing to everypaysite owners inbox and let them know how "okay" it is. good detective work! *rum*

You should post this over here: http://forums.sims2community.com/showthread.php?t=41351&page=5&pp=25

Done. :wink:

Heh. Glad to see the change in language from give us a list and we'll look into it to we're investigating.

Thanks, Sparkle, for sending this inquiry.

This should make site owners think at least a little. Good info.

What is interesting is that you specifically asked about Homecrafter and Bodyshop and their reply included "custom content".   Does this mean they are including objects or anything that is made in SimPE as well?

ea considers anything not made by them to be custom content aka user-made content (they use both terms on the site itself) so yes.
The first part of the response from EA seems canned. The whole "incident, concerns" part. But the rest seems specific to what she asked, unless they have alot of people asking them if its ok to sell their creations lol

Thanks a lot! There's actually some hope now  :D

*mr burns* Excellent! */mr burns*

Smithers! Fetch me some paysite owners so I can watch them squirm as they read that letter from EA.................

Ha ha, I'd like to see a paysite owner assure us what he/she's doing is legal after reading that!  :P

but paysites (and yes, TSR...EA's little buddy) claim they arent selling items per se, but "access" to the site for "bandwidth" purposes

or

it's a "donation"

 :roll:


hopefully EA squashes those little cockroaches when Sims3 comes out, as I doubt they will do a damned thing before then....

LOL, I always find that funny when paysites call them "donations." You bloody buy their content, you don't "donate" to their site and get a "gift" in return. A "donation" would imply that you're not getting anything.

Wonder if TSR has heard the news yet.

a lot of paysites ESPECIALLY EXNEM use the defense "oh but i don't make my shit in bodyshop, all my meshes are made from scratch in milkshape" or something like that. is that a valid argument?

nope


cuz they have to use EA code to make it into a package file for the game

Well the making-of-the-lists might have got the ball rolling Hecubus :D When it comes down to it, the paysites havent got a leg to stand on...whilst we have a wooden pirate leg! Yarr! *passes rum*

That's an odd statement from EA.  Violations of copyright law don't depend on whether or not the stuff is being sold.  Even if you give stuff away for free, you can violate copyright (all those Disney beddings, etc.). Furthermore, copyright law violation is a separate issue from violating the EULA.  The statement seems to imply that they're checking only for copyright violations (based on "selling", which in itself is not a neccessary condition), not on EULA violations.  

It reads like something tossed off, not something composed with the law in mind.  I wonder how serious it is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donation



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sale

dietofworms - Even though it's a typical kind of non-clarifying corporate email response I believe they are laying claim to the copyright of the .package format.

It's the only thing they can enforce since they don't hold the trademark or copyright to say Disney materials.  The terms of use of the package file allows for free distribution but not to have their copyrightable thing resold.

It's a neat way to bypass the Eula altogether and gives them clear legal control over their game content.

Selling content is illegal, sharing it for free is not  :D  (well thats the way I read it, correct me if I am wrong)

Rickets, thanks.  That makes sense, I guess.  Except that even if EA's strategy is to claim copyright over the package files, I don't see how they can enforce a "no selling of derivative products" policy without also getting the EULA involved.

I don't think copyright owners can make distinctions between giving away and selling derivative products, once they've granted permission for people to use their intellectual property to make such products.

So ultimately it's the EULA that counts, and EULA's tend to be hard to enforce.  

But no matter what, EA's intent about people not profiting from derivative products is clear, and it would be nice if that were honored even without a legal ruling.

There's no real way to make a derivative work from a package file.  It's always going to be a package file or it won't work in the game.  Regardless of the contents of the file the code is always going to be a package file over which EA Games holds the copyright.  

They can do with their package file what they wish based on their grant of rights.  And it doesn't even have to be anywhere in writing that you can't sell someone else's copyrighted thing -- it's just a legal given.  If they don't want Sims stuff sold then they can fire off a bunch of cease and desist letters and contact some IPs.

EULAs for a game rated TEEN will never be brought up in any legal way if a company can get around it.  If you're under 18 in the US you can't even agree to a legal document or licensing agreement in the first place so the EULA is worthless.

Geez, I feel like I'm at work...

That's the first time that has been mentioned (to my knowledge) and really makes alot of sense.
Also, what is your job, if you don't mind me asking?

Disney website says you can use disney images as long as it is not for commercial purposes. I am guessing the only way you'd get a shitfit from disney is if you: defame their characters (shame on you) or sell whatever you made with their images on it (*points at exnem*)
If you want to make wallpapers and share them for free, they wont complain, its just free advertising for them. Although I think they would appreciate it more if people specifically said "Disney's Little Mermaid Official website: http://disney.com" ya know, actually credit them, so that people might visit the website and buy crap.

keirra - I work in tv and/or film in the art department.  In terms of the legal stuff my day is filled with things like trying to figure out how to get the rights to use a print by Picasso or a Time magazine cover from 1974 on screen.  I know nothing about say fighting a parking ticket in court but I know a heckuva lot about copyright and trademark law.

Sounds like a very interesting job.  Thanks for answering.

I wish Josh was actually on to talk to at this moment, I so want to boil his blood up, it's fun :)

Shame he appears to be offline on Skype...maybe if I spam rings on him he'll pretend to stop being offline.

Anyway

Great to see this development, I cant wait to see paysites BUUUURRRN!!

I posted this message there http://forums.sims2community.com/showpost.php?p=890953&postcount=111  

and got a strange pm from someone called Blondmermaid.  I wondered if she knew or owned the site?

Her email was like eh ah eh no no how do you know blah blah, so I just said well it was calculated by someone at THE SITE THAT MUST NOT BE NAMED!  and left it at that.  Oh and I checked and the objects alone on Vitasims must be near to $200 dollar and thats just objects!!

Blondmermaid is the site owner.

Funny she emailed you about that post. Did she think she could argue against plain fact?

I've been noticing, that's exactly what some people try to do. Makes me laugh every time. Well, I am easily entertained.  :lol:

It's not like she couldn't figure it out for herself....start with the number of sets available (you can count right on the site), and multiply. Surely even SHE could figure that out...even with currency conversions courtesty of xe.com.

Sheesh, some peoples is dumb. Or in utter denial.

Has anyone dared to copy/paste that letter at TSR? 'Cause that would be fun, if it didn't get deleted within seconds.

Also, an OT question: When does Sims 3 come out? I so can't wait to see that. :D

I read that on a german site that its late 2008 in the USA and early 2009 in Europe.