PMBD

I have since visited EA in Redwood Shores and had numerous meetings with the web and legal teams there.

You appear to choose not to take any action based on the same excuse the
pirates were using at the time, the Sims 2 End User Licence Agreement
(EULA).

At that time the EULA specified that users could not sell for profit any
custom creations made using game code.

As a result, the EULA was changed in August
2007 to remove any references to Non Commercial sites from the Custom
Content EULA.

EA no longer has an opinion on the distribution of Custom
Content on Free/Donation/Pay sites.

The EULA which they (and seemingly
you) used to hide behind has been invalid now for a year.

Given that we have made this formal request, our only option thereafter is
legal, and now that you are knowingly hosting these files we would attempt
to recover all legal costs from your company.

Regards,
<NO NAME GIVEN>

Dear sirs,

Omg liek stop steelin are filez  ;___;  we r ttly BFFs with EA n dey arent suing us, so we r sue U!!!1

so take down teh booty or u will b SORY!!!!!!1 U SELF-CONFESSED PIRATES OMG

BAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWW

signed,

Mr. Internet Lawyerguy

Given that we have made this formal request, our only option thereafter is
legal, and now that you are knowingly hosting these files we would attempt
to recover all legal costs from your company.

Regards,
<NO NAME GIVEN>

Steve is the owner of TSR. I highly doubt Steve would not sign his name.

Given that we have made this formal request, our only option thereafter is
legal,

Maybe it was really Atwa.

Summary for those who can't see it for whatever reason/don't speak wankese:

QUESTION
What is the EA End User License Agreement?
Answer

EA TOOLS END USER LICENSE Electronic Arts Inc, and its subsidiaries, affiliates and licensors(collectively, "EA") grants you a non-transferable non-exclusive license to download and/or install and use one copy of the software tool ("Tool") and/or materials ("Materials") (collectively the "Tools & Materials") solely for your personal noncommercial use in connection with EA's products, in accordance with the terms below.EA owns all of the rights, title and interest in the Tools & Materials. You may not alter any of EA's trademarks or logos, or alter or remove any of EA's trademark or copyright notices included in or with the Tools & Materials or EA's products. Your right to use Tools & Materials is limited to the license grant above, and you may not otherwise copy, display, distribute, perform, publish, modify, create works from, or use any of the Tools & Materials. Without limiting the preceding sentence, you may not modify, reverse engineer, disassemble, license, transfer, distribute, create works from, or sell the Tool, or use the Tools & Materials to further any commercial purpose. Without limiting the foregoing, you may not use the Tools & Materials to promote another product or business, or on any site that operates or promotes a server emulator. You may include materials created with the Tools & Materials on your personal noncommercial website for the noncommercial benefit of the fan community for EA's products and provided that if you do so, you must also post the following notice on your site on the same web page(s) where those materials are located:"This site is not endorsed by or affiliated with Electronic Arts, or its licensors. Trademarks are the property of their respective owners.

Game content and materials copyright Electronic Arts Inc. and its licensors.
"All Rights Reserved." You will not represent that your site is endorsed or approved by or affiliated with EA or our licensors or that any other content on your site is endorsed or approved by or affiliated with EA or our licensors.

Pescado, did you get this via email ?  What happened in the two days since you got it?  I think it's not so horribly written that it couldn't be by Steve.  The switching between "I" and "we" is sloppy, but not ungrammatical.  Was the signature clipped out, or was there never any signature?

I have to wonder.. why now?  PMBD has been around for what, nearly 2 years now?  The info included in the threat is also inaccurate so I don't know why he/she even bothered.   ::)

They clearly continue to support and encourage all constructive fan sites in the community.

LOL! Falln, that's a great cat pic. One I hadn't seen before!

So TSR is throwing legal threats out. Hm, why am I not surprised. lol. It probably is just some 12 year old TSR lover (who pretends to know big words) trying to scare away the big bad pirates from their favorite site. Oh noes! We better all get lawyers! ::)

In response:

Dear Thomass and twats,

BITE US.

- the pirates

I'm pretty sure its a legit email from the TSR higher ups.  It's pseudo-legal language makes me think that because it just sounds so much like a scam artist.  Scam artists use pseudo-legalease all the time to make themselves sound more legitmate.  And I can't think of a bigger bunch of scam artists than TSR.

I'm pretty sure its a legit email from the TSR higher ups.  It's pseudo-legal language makes me think that because it just sounds so much like a scam artist.  Scam artists use pseudo-legalease all the time to make themselves sound more legitmate.  And I can't think of a bigger bunch of scam artists than TSR.

This letter reeks of Sim_Outlaw to me. I wouldn't put something like this past him.

This letter reeks of Sim_Outlaw to me. I wouldn't put something like this past him. ::)

Given that we have made this formal request, our only option thereafter is
legal, and now that you are knowingly hosting these files we would attempt
to recover all legal costs from your company.

As a result, the EULA was changed in August
2007 to remove any references to Non Commercial sites from the Custom
Content EULA. EA no longer has an opinion on the distribution of Custom
Content on Free/Donation/Pay sites. They clearly continue to support and
encourage all constructive fan sites in the community

The bit on the end of the threat saying that they would recover legal costs from your company is that Pescado or are they trying to scare the web providers of pmbd into taking the whole  site down.

They're apparently trying to threaten to sue the Malaysians, yes.

They're apparently trying to threaten to sue the Malaysians, yes.

Well, that is interesting and sounds a bit futile.  Don't the Malaysians have an "Eh, you suck" attitude toward this kind of thing?

<lulzy post>

I always spell it kerfuffle.  :-\ Hahaha! He should play the sims and read the eula that came with freetime.  PC's in the shop at the mo' - but Sherrie has it - all hail Sherrie. http://www.sherriesim.com/site/info/news.html (http://www.sherriesim.com/site/info/news.html)

I also enjoy this quote:


Yet EA do nothing.
Yet EA don't change their EULA.
Yet EA don't even clear up the exchange.
No lawyer worth their salt would bother with this malarkey.



I hope when Apartment Life comes out, a kind pirate screenshots the EULA again, which will undoubtedly be the same.  :D I will do it if the compy is back.

I have since visited EA in Redwood Shores and had numerous meetings with
the web and legal teams there.

kerfuffle.... yeah. TSR has lost there minds. Just a bunch of guttersnipes crying there little eyes out for money and a cookie. :P

I haven't been following TSR drama until lately so to me it seems they just lost their minds. Silly me.
P.S. Cookies were laced with cyanide.

Fresh and strait from the oven Chocolate  chip cookies with special "BLUE" sprinkles.Made for TSR eat up.  :-X

By special request from panthpirate a special cyanide Thomas cookie Atwat. Enjoy!!

I am always late for the Thomas Cookie and Chalie party....  :-*

By special request from panthpirate a special cyanide Thomas cookie Atwat. Enjoy!!
<snipped scary thomass cookie>

Date: December 12, 2007


ELECTRONIC ARTS
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Pub. Doc. No. 39301v1/Temp.Doc.No. 37026v14

OK, kids. EULA from install of Apartment Life. Note the date. Note non-commercial. Specifically, under 1A. "Any commercial use is prohibited." Also, from 15. "This License constitutes the entire agreement between you and EA with respect to the Software and supersedes all prior or contemporaneous understandings regarding such subject matter."

Suck it, TSR.

A. Grant. Through this purchase, you are acquiring and EA grants you a personal, non-exclusive license to install and use the Software for your personal, non-commercial use solely as set forth in this License and the accompanying documentation. Your acquired rights are subject to your compliance with this Agreement. Any commercial use is prohibited. Esspt TSR cuz dey iz our palz lolololol ftw

3. Steve and Thom Ass can't read.  :'(

? What about:

3. Steve and Thom Ass can't read.  :'(

Let's band together for The Sellers Reading Association.  Send monies nao! Help ThomAss and Steve read - or on your own head be it.

Won't somebody think of the paysite owners?!?!?!11!?!?!  :D

I thought Filthypriest's avatar was his own.  When I saw the cookie I thought wow doesn't Filthypriest look like thomarse.  I didn't want to point it out incase I hurt his feelings.  I was wondering why I was the only one who could see the resemblance.  Just lurked in a different thread where his avi is mentioned.  I am so so sorry Filthypriest

I are confuzzled about the multitudinous EULA's myself.  Can someone either point me to a link or explain why there seem to be different EULA's or the history of the changes/nonchanges?

But are there really diffferent EULA's?  I think it's been consistent.  (Except for the speshul TSR struggling-reader one). 

AL EULA

One of the free programs EA released, I believe it was its content manager one, had removed the part about commerical websites.  However, every EULA that's come with every other release--game, ep's, stuff packs, bodyshop, etc has included the copy that probits commerical use.

But you couln't make content with the content manager. Just manage the content you already had on your compute.
So there wasn't really any need for a part about commersial websites... ::)

Unfortunately, you are now one of the last hosts providing a safe haven for the self confessed pirates to promote the theft and distribution of  Sims 2 artist's intellectual property.

So the EULA is still the same as it has always been.... and even if it did change for that one expansion pack, everything before, and everything that came out since it changed back is still in violation of the EULA.

FilthyPriest, I sure hope that you can read that into Swedish for them, at least I think they are Swedes...

I are confuzzled about the multitudinous EULA's myself.  Can someone either point me to a link or explain why there seem to be different EULA's or the history of the changes/nonchanges?

Thanks Cala-that is the brouhaha I remember.  I just couldn't recall the details, but I knew something happened with some EULA somewhere. 

Of course, now I realize that the EULA's did not change for the actual homecrafter/bodyshop, which you would think would end the argument.  However, I would like to point out that while I might not be a supergenius, I am not stupid either and I was fooled by this for a time.  Just saying.

Are you sure TSR doesnt pay taxes? Cos it is owned by a registered company Ibibi AB (Dunno what Ibibi means..? Isaacson Bonham In Bed with.. oh.. fail)

Ibibi AB
Generatorhallen
826 30 Söderhamn
Sweden

Someone (I think it was here on PMBD) said that AB is the Swedish equivalent of Inc, or Ltd or summin like that. So maybe they do pay some tax??

But don't they teach english in swedish schools. I mean thought most countries of the EU teach it as a part of multiculturalism.

Don't know - my friend from Sweden speaks really good english, but he said he taught himself to play video games, and since he does web design type stuff, uses English more than Swedish.  To the point where he said he sometimes loses his Swedish....

OT: Not to generalize or anything  :D, I'm always amazed at the language skills of Europeans, Israelis, etc., compared with north Americans.  It's relatively rare here to be fluent in a second language unless you're an immigrant or second generation.  Our schools tend to teach languages as if it's not important to learn them, because we are after all AMERICANS ::).    Alia, you seem to have perfect English.  And a lot of other people here from Europe and elsewhere do, too.

Yep, depending on the type of the company, AB stands either for Ltd or Inc, so if they have been able to register TSR as a company I'm betting they actually do pay taxes. What a pity we can't bust Thomass for tax evasion.  :-\

OT: Not to generalize or anything  :D, I'm always amazed at the language skills of Europeans, Israelis, etc., compared with north Americans.  It's relatively rare here to be fluent in a second language unless you're an immigrant or second generation.  Our schools tend to teach languages as if it's not important to learn them, because we are after all AMERICANS ::).    Alia, you seem to have perfect English.  And a lot of other people here from Europe and elsewhere do, too.

I think (and I might be wrong) that the British and the Australians, who are also native English speakers, are also not famous for their wonderful multi-linguistic abilities. 

True.  Although there may be less resistance here due to the multicultural agendas - and due to the fact that we have a high proportion of imported people from lotsa countries.  I can swear in many languages, and know a little Spanish, a little Egyptian Arabic and passable French. My kids are learning Italian at primary school, and I'm unsure what they offer them at high school, as it varies from school to school.

In the US we are going to have to start teach spanish on a wider scale

I don't know.  I haven't met with a lot of resistance.  Plus, the US is known as the melting pot.  We also have people from all over.  Maybe the main difference is that we encourage immigrants to become "Americanized"?  I am not sure what the Australian attitude toward that is. 

As for as the USA-immigrants-languages debate, I believe that if you move to a country and you intend to live there, you should do two things:

A.) Come there LEGALLY.

B.) Learn to speak whatever language is official there.

I just meant the ones coming over because ... I have no idea why they come over. I guess Mexico is horrible? But I'm sure if they were about to be massacred the tourist business would have dropped and it would have made the news.

As for as the USA-immigrants-languages debate, I believe that if you move to a country and you intend to live there, you should do two things:

A.) Come there LEGALLY.

B.) Learn to speak whatever language is official there.

I am totally opposed to sanctions on illegal immigrants in the US.  The vast majority of people without green cards come here for the sole purpose of making enough money to support their families. Getting here legally is a long and involved process, and not everyone can do so.  The US is the richest country in the world--surely we can afford to give jobs, social services, education, etc. to people who have nothing.

I always think of the thousands of European Jews who were trying to get out of the way of the Nazis and died needlessly because no country would take them in. Including the US, which had quotas on Jewish admissions.  I hope we're a more compassionate nation than that now.

*gets off soapbox*

Since I am late to the party...."GO PES!"

Also, I cannot speak for other countries, however, all three of my children have taken Spanish for numerous years - 2 are fluent.  Now, the two older children are taking Latin and French.  I, however, still speak fluent Southern.  :D

Who's up for just bringing back latin and unifying the world??

The big problem with immigration that affects us all is that illegals don't pay taxes, but often use public services that cost taxpayer money. I'm all for relatively free immigration, but the financials need to be re-evaluated. It's a big confusing mess to me, but the key, I believe, is actually in making the legalization process easier.

Alternatively, we could get rid of these services which merely serve to drain taxpayer money. Without the welfare state, we have nothing to fear from immigrants.

Yeah, but see, *CANADA* doesn't have to worry about this sort of thing. CANADA doesn't share a border with a poor nation, so there aren't exactly tons of people running over there. Thus, they can afford to be a socialist nanny state and not be swamped by foreign freeloaders. Over HERE, I say we put up a work-or-starve policy and we'll quickly see who the REAL Americans are.

Screw you $hithead >:( No Pescado doesn't, leave him alone.He may be a carmudeon sometimes but he knows what he is talking about unlike you.

Pescado is hardly going to go and cry himself to sleep because someone called him an 'asshole'

Illegal immigrants who work in the US help shore up the Social Security Trust Fund. They work, their FICA taxes got into it...SNIP

Not the ones that get paid cash under the table, which happens quite often.  I don't know about the ones that have fake SS numbers.

About 90 percent of the time in cases he's investigated, Utah's Hamp said, the numbers used belong to a real person. But even in the other cases, there's still harm done: the number may be issued in the future, meaning a baby may be born with a surprising financial past.

Note the person's sig - 'MATY Baiter' - so they've come from MATY just to bitch at Pes (bar their other post which was about the Evi fat skinny girl creations)...how charming  ::)

Is anyone else troubled by how entirely off-topic this discussion has become?

Perhaps there would be more room for socialist nanny state policies if the government stopped giving rich people money and applied it elsewhere.

Or we could both stop giving rich people more money AND stop taking people's money. Imagine if you just KEPT more of what you earned and used it for yourself, instead of dumping it on a bloated governmental budget. It's a strange concept, aye, that we might be better off with LESS government everywhere, hrm?

Or we could both stop giving rich people more money AND stop taking people's money. Imagine if you just KEPT more of what you earned and used it for yourself, instead of dumping it on a bloated governmental budget. It's a strange concept, aye, that we might be better off with LESS government everywhere, hrm?

Fair tax! Fair Tax! (http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer)

Pescado, calalily; you're such idealists.

It is a jackass, pure and simple. It was not wanted at MATY, either. (http://www.moreawesomethanyou.com/smf/index.php/topic,12820.0.html)

That purports to bring fairness by making a retail sales tax - but with the rise of China and India, and the possibilities of offshore holders of USian companies, that may not be such a good idea into the future.  Mainly because a large amount of revenue would be going overseas, and not in fact be spent in the US.  It also would mean wiping out tariffs - adding the possibility that a lot of American industries would die in the arse.

Make it cheaper for the companies and they will just keep the prices up, and pocket the change, unless another companys comes along selling for less.

Well that's basically the principle of the American Corporation. It's a model that is designed to place the emphasis on profit and shareholder gain, often to exclusion of all other considerations. CEO's are practically obliged by American Law to do whatever is necessary to make a profit even to the detriment of community interests if the two come into conflict. If you look at the history of the Corporation from it's inception and the principles it was founded on to what it has become, you understand why it doesn't concern itself with any citizens need that is not a shareholder. They exist to make a profit, they are obliged to do that under the law, they do not exist for the betterment of society as a whole. If that happens it's collateral. So in the end, any attempt to make it easier for them to do business is only going to increase their profit margin and put more money in the pockets of the people who hold shares because American Corporate governance law dictate that.

That would depend.  Part of the fair tax" replaces federal income taxes including personal, estate, gift, capital gains, alternative minimum, Social Security, Medicare, self-employment, and corporate taxes." So, it will become cheaper to actually have businesses in this country instead of shuffling them off overseas. 

Considering that many corporations don't actually pay some of the federal taxes, they just pass the money spent along to the consumer, prices for American goods will go down, not up, even with the embedded tax. 

The government will make the same amount of money to fund programs, and we will have cheaper or at least the same price for goods.  Additionally, since you get your entire paycheck, plus a prebate based upon basic living expenses every month, hopefully people won't need welfare programs at the same rate they do now. 

Trade is a completely separate issue.  And the current tax system doesn't address trade problems anyway. 

Make it cheaper for the companies and they will just keep the prices up, and pocket the change, unless another companys comes along selling for less.

It's not going to come down to the bargain basement prices that China and India offer - unless you slash the living standards of Americans.  No matter how cheap the taxation system makes things, China and India still win out on those fronts. So it won't in fact redress the amount of stuff produced in foreign countries (which is what tariffs do).
 

They removed a 22% sales tax on some items here and replaced it with a flat tax of 10% on everything (barring essentials) and that was heralded as somehow going to bring prices down.  But because the market is allowed freedom, they didn't actually ever come down in price.  The supermarkets absorbed that profit, and people's prices went up by 10%.
 

Not necessarily - those on middle class incomes will have their quality of life go up substantially, but those on minimum wage will be in just less dire straits.  They may still require welfare services, particularly with all the extra money spent sending inflation through the roof.

Tariffs are taxes levelled by the government - so they do apply.  If they are wiped out under the fair tax system, it will be even cheaper to buy Chinese and Indian stuff than it is to buy American.

That's the problem with the market - on essential items, there is no reason to be as competitive as possible - everyone needs them anyway.  Libertarians dream of a market that responds and undercuts itself - and I've yet to see this have an effect on companies.  Most are content (without government intervention) to fix the prices of things - after all - you're going to buy them anyway.

Good debate! I love a reasonable discussion with people I respect. I gotta run to work, but I wanted to address a couple of these points. 

While I see your point with cheaper labor and no one can beat .50 cents an hour or whatever stupid wage some countries pay, the fact that exported good are not subject to the Fair Tax, while imported goods are will help even things out. 

The flat tax and the fair tax are not the same thing.  Did you also remove any kind of government income tax? Did they also remove corporate taxes, social security taxes, gift taxes, etc?    I don't know how the Australian tax system is set up. 

I didn't say that welfare programs would be eliminated, just that perhaps less people would need them or need them for less time. 

The fair tax only taxes on what you spend, not on what you earn. In fact, according to this blog, the poor come out much better under the Fair Tax system than the current American tax system

I know what tariffs are.  I don't think they are wiped out by the Fair Tax, but see my response above.  Imported goods will be taxed, exported goods will not.

It is cheaper to buy Chinese stuff now, including all the lead and formaldehyde they include in their products. 

On essential items, you won't be taxed. 

Additionally, business to business purchases for production of goods and services are also not taxed, driving the cost of production down further.

I cannot imagine why this would not impact the final price of new goods.  Used good are not taxed at all! The tax is paid once on new goods and nothing on used goods.  So, if I can buy something used with no tax those that make new goods would want to be competitive with that certainly.

Markets will undercut themselves if left alone.  Part, and not all,  of what keeps prices high are the stupid taxes the government imposes on businesses (that the government wastes horribly, but that is another topic) that they, in turn, pass along to the consumer. 

I encourage any Americans to check it out, do a little research (especially the Supreme Court cases supporting it), and decide if you think it's legit or not.

http://www.barefootsworld.net/index.html

If it's not too off topic  ;D, I would appreciate it if those who check it out comment about it (Or can I start a thread about this here?).

Pescadoesque

Perfect name for a Sims Strip Joint.  ;)

You guys are hot!

*and yes I mean that in the sexy time way*

Well then, they're not wiping out all taxes and putting up a fair tax - they're replacing one system of taxation for another. 

You guys are hot!

*and yes I mean that in the sexy time way*

Who's idea was income tax in the first place? Is it too late to burn them in effigy? For some reason I want to think it was Benjamin Franklin and if it was, well, that particular invention was a solid lead clinker.

I have more to say, but I gotta run and do some work stuff.  I hate having to work. 

That is exactly right! In fact that is the point of the Fair Tax.  It is not so much tax reform as it is tax replacement.  They are not saying to get rid of taxes, as that would be dumb, but to tax in a more fair way than the current system does.  I really don't understand some of the protests (not yours, I get what you are saying) that some people have on this.  This way everyone gets taxed based upon what they buy.  The rich, who buy more expensive things will pay a higher tax.  No loop holes.  Food and essentials are not taxed at all, through the use of the prebate.  No tax code, no IRS.  In fact, the 16th amendment] (http://www.renewamerica.us/issues/ron_paul.htm) would have to be repealed before this can work.  The IRS goes away.  Probably my favorite part of this proposal.

I don't like the way the current system works, and frankly, almost anything would be better. 

Who's idea was income tax in the first place? Is it too late to burn them in effigy? For some reason I want to think it was Benjamin Franklin and if it was, well, that particular invention was a solid lead clinker.

That is exactly right! In fact that is the point of the Fair Tax.  It is not so much tax reform as it is tax replacement.  They are not saying to get rid of taxes, as that would be dumb, but to tax in a more fair way than the current system does.  I really don't understand some of the protests (not yours, I get what you are saying) that some people have on this.  This way everyone gets taxed based upon what they buy.  The rich, who buy more expensive things will pay a higher tax.

I wouldn't have to dig him up to burn him in effigy, just make a likeness and burn it is all. And Pescado, I take it that you make your own lye soap for washing? That would fit your miserly ways... Fat, wood ashes and a few other things will get you a brew that will clean anything and take the skin off of your bones if you aren't careful.

I wouldn't have to dig him up to burn him in effigy, just make a likeness and burn it is all. And Pescado, I take it that you make your own lye soap for washing? That would fit your miserly ways... Fat, wood ashes and a few other things will get you a brew that will clean anything and take the skin off of your bones if you aren't careful.

Soap? Washing?

It's a strange concept, aye, that we might be better off with LESS government everywhere, hrm?

I'm sorry but someone who wears the same jeans everyday, there is no way to be nice or polite......

deelink you could try just giving him a little pet name see if he picks up on it. Like "Hey Stinkosis, wassup dude" or "Yo FunkNasty, got any toner?" or "Bonjour M. Le Pew, how was your weekend, did ya get any?" yanno something subtle like that. That's what I'd do, but that's just me.

As I opened the door I could hear giggling behind me, so I turned and saw the CEO of the shop, laughing his ass off. Emoboy scurried off red faced.

he said to me in this really bright voice "My washing machine is fixed!" to which I replied "It was broken for a year? Mr Pew?" he blinked and the HEAD HONCHO was right behind me. I didn't know.
I sighed and said "Forget it, it was mean. Good to hear it dude" and kept walking.

I can't live without showering every day. On working days I shower twice. I'm a nurse, I'd feel grossed out to touch anything at home before taking a shower.
I read something in a paper that showering twice a week is pretty normal for alot of people in Europe, especially for 50+ people. They just do the rest at the sink.

Oh don't even joke about not bathing....I have to deal with people who honestly believe that unless they see lice crawling on their body, they won't even BEGIN to think about personal hygene. It's so fucking disgusting.

Excessive bathing weakens the immune system and is a mark of the soft and weak. Plus it is that much harder to damage me when you have to chop your way through an armored layer of encrusted grime.

"It was broken for a year? Mr Pew?" he blinked and the HEAD HONCHO was right behind me.

Excessive bathing weakens the immune system and is a mark of the soft and weak. Plus it is that much harder to damage me when you have to chop your way through an armored layer of encrusted grime.

Like many field trips and such will say that where ever you go the place to visit isn't responsible if a child gets hurt, but yet isn't it their responsibility to protect and keep that child from harm?

That's because otherwise, if somehow a child does get hurt, they will get sued - in a country where people can get sued -by the person breaking into their house- for any injuries the robber gets while commiting a crime, and the robber -wins-, there is a problem.

One of many reasons why my parents taught me to shoot to kill.   ;)

Excessive bathing weakens the immune system and is a mark of the soft and weak. Plus it is that much harder to damage me when you have to chop your way through an armored layer of encrusted grime.

Are you scared that if you have a shower, you'll disintegrate and vanish down the plug hole?

...just as an example of people not really being willing to do anything about climate change, when I was in France I stayed with a host family. It was the middle of summer in Australia and I had become used to the very very fast showers with a bucket in the corner collecting the excess to use on the garden. So when I was in France I continued with the quick showers. After about a week my host mother interrogated me on my hygeine wanting to know why i spent so little time in the bathroom. I explained about the drought in Australia and how we had water restrictions and her response was- well this is France. We have enough water. Have longer showers, you should shower for at least 10 minutes then I know you will be clean.

Have we got a few nurses here?

I have this issue where I tend to kind of lose time in the bathroom in the morning. I think I must still be half asleep. I waste a lot of water while just sitting there until I snap to. I'm a night owl and tend to want to stay up until the wee hours of the morning but yet have to get up at a decent time, leading to my getting too little sleep during the week. I try to enforce a strict midnight bedtime on school nights. Sometimes it works.

On a shower in the afternoon, I'm in and out in five minutes tops. That's if I have to shave the legs.

TapThatBooty, you've obviously lost your shift key. Here's another for you.

snip

Adults use basic sentence structure, this is an adult forum.

I like showers. Not baths. I don't wanna soak. I hate showering in the morning when it's cold outside. I sneeze in the shower. I don't even want to get out of bed on those days. I like to stay snuggled up in the covers. Damn I can't wait til November.

Sorry, my keyboard is set up like a stupid laptop one. I had spilled tea on my old one so I had got this one, the layout is all different, instead of hitting the "shift" key, I'm hitting the "?" key, so I've got to try and find the backspace button, only yo hit the "+" key. 'Tis very frustraiting.

Me thinks you no like me, you always gives me into trouble  :'(

 ;)

TapThatBooty, these cruel, heartless bastards :P will rip into anyone given even half an excuse.  Don't take it personal.  Its just their idea of fun.
 

TapThatBooty, these cruel, heartless bastards :P will rip into anyone given even half an excuse.  Don't take it personal.  Its just their idea of fun.

*Snip*

Hehe, yeah I know its all in the name of fun. I've been lurking for a while now, so I've got used to the banter here.

I'm more of a shower person really. Ive seen me go into the shower and forget to come out again. I've been told I have OCD, which seems right, if I get a tiny bit of dirt on me, then clothes are off and in the wash, and im in the shower scrubbing until my skin is red.

I'm like that with cleaning too. If something is off center, then out comes the dusters, hovers, window cleaners, the lot.
When I'm hanging pictures up on the wall, out comes the spirit level and measuring tape, so that each picture is evenly spaced out and level.
My boyfriend calls me Monica from Friends, because if something needs cleaned, then I cant relax until it is done, but then it leads to a cleaning frenzy.

I've moved a room around before because something looked out of place so I rearanged the furniture to make it fit with the rest of the room. :D

Haha, how did you end up with that gig?
I'd hate to live with 4 blokes, I coud just imagine the chaos that would cause. I'd be cleaning constantly, they'd love it, I'd get annoyed with them  ;D.

But you should see one of my frenzies, i get my rubber gloves out and everything, people have learnt to stay out of my way when I get like that, I snap at anyone who gets in my way. And like most Scottish blokes, i have a bad temper  ::).