TSR: In Ur Accounts, Deletin Ur Stuffs!

[kenmtl]

Notwithstanding the fact that no one knows who the fuck she's talking to, and notwithstanding the fact that no one cares, Dot does make a point about "other" creators and their "other" tools. I can't imagine the Diva "altitudes" of their TOU's being acceptable to TSR even thought they're clearly written for the Owners themselves anyway. (Her liberal interpretation of the rules of capitalization not mine) 

That being said we all know the distance between what Thomas announces and the truth is often expansive.

Also notwithstanding her earlier aviation analogy fail, this has me in perplexion. "The TSR Workshop is a package deal, with everything in it for an artist, and what they need to be creative, advanced or beginner soon enough." WTF does that even mean?

[SnarkyShark]

Also notwithstanding her earlier aviation analogy fail, this has me in perplexion. "The TSR Workshop is a package deal, with everything in it for an artist, and what they need to be creative, advanced or beginner soon enough." WTF does that even mean?

It comes preloaded with meshes by buggybooz.

[Anyerfillag]

There's a new post in the TSR news section, but sadly it says nothing about the new member, just FA and SA incentives

Snarky: ROFL! Don't you mean Shakeshaft meshes?

[CatOfWar]

Plus you could use the amazing TSR wiki if you need help understanding the tool

Does she mean the wiki with stuff copied from the free community?

-----------------------

Peter will probably stop developing s3oc cloner once Workshop is fully featured and everyone is comfortable with it.

edit: Just read Inge's comment at TSR that Peter will stop working on his suite of tools once the TSR tool is done.  Rather disappointing.  I'm aware Inge and Peter aren't into the pay/free debate, and believe tools are just tools.  However, I would like there to be an alternative to TSR's tool.  If the free community uses it, many will see it as an endorsement of TSR, it is good press for TSR.  What really rankles is how TSR would get this, by screwing the free community in the ass.  Whose freely shared knowledge allowed them to make their tool?  Who wrote much of the wiki?  And where are the links to MTS that Thoma$$ promised Delphy?

[Quorneater]

That's not quite the conclusion I was intending to result from my comment.  s3pe will be unaffected.   s3oc cloner presumably will just stay doing what it does, and be updated where necessary for EPs.  I was trying to say that there would be no need to continue developing it into a more fully featured modding tool.

I think it will be more fun for people to use Workshop as the beta I am testing has many features that will make creating easier, and surely most people play the game and create for fun, not for a political exercise?   

[CatOfWar]

Inge - Glad to hear Peter's tools will be updated for new EPs, thanks for clarifying.

I do understand what you're saying, I just have a different view.  While I do play and create for fun, when it comes to choosing tools, I do not separate the TSR tool from TSR the company.  I know you're aware of their wrongdoing, but you separate tools from politics.  I won't demand that Peter write a free community version of the TSR tool and stick a non-commercial TOU on it (though I would be thrilled and grateful if he did).  I won't ask you to shun Thomas and TSR.  However, if you are going to praise the TSR tool on TSR's site, why not also ask Thomas about the links to MTS that he promised in exchange for help with said tool?  Why not also tell them to give credit for much of the content on their wiki?  Even if (and it's an if in my mind) they've done something good or useful, they should not benefit from it when they're getting away with all their past and current wrongdoing.

[dstar]

   The simple or rather not so simple fact of the matter is that TSR's actions have been so unethical  and illegal both in terms of general human decency (you don't lie, you don't steal, you treat others with respect when they treat you with respect), and in terms of basic  business ethics that tools are not just tools when they bear TSR's name, they are weapons, just like an ax is just a tool until you put it into the hands of a serial killer then it becomes a weapon.

   The people who run TSR  do not respect anyone in the community- not even their own programmers, modders (such as they are) and creators- they certainly do not respect the respected members of the free community who have helped them in the development of their tools (tools which are weapons since it has been reported that at least 5 different virus programs have set off alarms after or during installation and some members of the free community were hacked after attempting to install the program and reporting said virus alerts- not the fault of the free programmers who helped develop I am sure,  just more TSR sneakiness and criminal behavior)- even if they appear to be nice to your faces.

  Think about it realistically here- if their intentions were any good towards the Free Community members who helped with the Workshop, or who are apparently helping with Merlin why are the fileshare friendly, or non Pay Tou's of the free tools created by these very same programmers NOT  being respected by TSR or any other pay creator that has used them to create pay or non fileshare friendly content.
   It is human nature to want to believe the best of people- but there are to very clear groups in this community-there are the creators, programmers and modders who only want to create things to help the community and there are the unethical businessmen and women like Thomas, Peggy and Rose who make their livings leaching off of these creators, programmers and modders  as well as those creators, programmers and modders(not that any paysite other than Simslice has programmers or modders) who choose to support their unethical behavior and to commit unethical acts for these BUSINESS OWNERS despite the fact they are one of the groups of people being taken advantage of and mistreated.


   It becomes necessary in this case to differentiate between those that truly do want this to be a united community where all can enjoy creating, and modding for the game and those who wish to take advantage of others desires to add things to their games to make them better by charging for the content and then committing unethical acts when people protest the quality of said content(as is their right to do under Consumer Protection Laws at the international level since TSR is selling a service and products) Shanow and WB should not have been disrespected in the way that they were simply because the reported a potential serious issue with a TSR product

   I tend to ignore most paysites in terms of outright hatred and lambasting frankly- ATS, Holy Simoly and other similar sites - other than the EULA violation issue, they are not the ultimate evil- they aren't stealing shit from other creators, hacking people's sites, ignoring other creators TOU's re: file sharing, posting to paysites,  not crediting original creators, sending threatening emails, banning people for even daring to complain about the quality of the content or ethics of the creators who make content that they pay for and have the right to complain about via consumer protection laws, making death threats, or denigrating other creators, modders and programmers throughout the pay and free communities. It is BUSINESSES like TSR( who is demonstrably guilty of the above listed acts) that are causing much of the divisiveness in the community.

     It is no longer an issue of for or against paysites in general because most of them stay the fuck away from the type of illegal, unethical behaviors committed by TSR and their supporters (yes violating the EULA is illegal and unethical but not on the same par as making malicious threats, hacking sites, or implanting viruses in your software programs and content)  it has become an issue of for or against, TSR, because this  BUSINESS  has committed many offenses against the community as a whole (if you think pay creators any more than free creators are getting credited by anyone at TSR, or that TSR FA's, SA's are asking for permission to use other pay creators meshes think again- since I am one for fair play at some level any creator who truly creates a mesh rather than stealing it from someone else Ala Shakeshaft deserves credit. Not a paycheck- there are real jobs for that and if they want to get paid for creating Sims content they should apply to EA)

    I know a lot of the programmers  and modders honestly want to believe that TSR has the best interests of the community at heart,but, given their behavior over the last several years, they don't- at least the people actually controlling things e.g. Thomas, Steve, and Johan do not- the actual programmers, site designers, and some of the creators may and I mean may at some very minimal level have some respect for the world outside TSR but the ones in charge do not - that is why I don't see this as just a tool- Sorry Inge, I know you want the divisiveness in the community to go away so that people can simply enjoy the game but, as long as TSR exists specifically, and paysites in general exist, and some of them continue to perpetrate illegal and unethical acts against the community- I don't see that happening.

   You can take their  willingness to work with you  as a demonstration of TSR/Thomas/Johan/Steve being willing to change but given the evidence to the contrary e.g iif they are so willing to change and know Atwa is behind most of the hackings, threatening emails, etc that have been committed against those that have revealed the inner workings of TSR, dared to leave their FA positions, or complained about faulty content- why have they not turned her over to the authorities- they would if they were so willing to change and these things would no longer to happening. If they were willing to change they would not have changed the version of the Workshop that free programmers created e.g. the one that did not set off virus alarms or cause BFBVS's with internet accounts and computers- to include harmful and malicious coding changes e.g viruses and keyloggers. If TSR was so willing to change why do their downloads still contain watermarks that most heavy duty virus programs, and spybot programs read  then as trojan viruses? If they are so willing to change why do they continue to allow unethical FA's who steal other creators content and/or use content without permission or credit to continue working for them. If they are so willing to change why is there absolutely no quality control for any content created by creators at the SA level or above?  Honestly the people who run that company are unethical, white collar criminals, why associate with them in any way?

[kenmtl]

So I'm sticking this here because I didn't where else to put it.

Anyway noticed this today and it caught my attention. It's from Modern_Sims's shoutbox at TSR. Don't know if it new or not.

"Well, I have something to say to all of you. First of all, I have recentely got promoted as a FA. And I would like to say sorry to people who could not download my creations for free like before. As I was thinking, and I will let people download it for free. I don't have any changes of this idea. So, I am giving up this position, FA. Actually, I don't really care if I will be a SA or a FA. The reason I am using this site is because I wanted to share things with many foreigners.
*One thing I want to say to you all is that please do not give my creations on other websites. You can get the items for FREE if you sign in to TSR. Plz, do not re-distribute my creations. You should download it in TSR.
I say again, I will not allow distribution without my permissions. I am asking you for at least a courtesy. If you don't follow the rules, I will stop making the creations. THX"

The first part is quite admirable actually and good for her/him. Maybe this one just needs new accommodations. Snitty tantrum TOU aside it seems like an honest desire to freely share content with the community. Is this new?

[dstar]

Do we have anyone on the inside that could offer them accommodation at an internationally known freesite like BPS? Freeing one of their FA's (especially one who has thrown the ahemm " honor" right back in their face cause their content would be pay) would be a bigtime smackdown for The Shit Resource.

[Dr House]

I'm quite amazed by Modern_Sims' message. Awesomely cool

[Missbonbon]

Sweet for Modern_sims. I liked most of their creations. Maybe someone could talk to them about hosting over at GOS or MTS. Their creations would probably fit better in with MTS though.

[rum nate]

Thats what I was thinking Missbonbon, someone sending them a PM pointing them to MTS. It would give their things a larger and nicer audience.

[neriana]

So what, the only place people are going to be able to get a program to create items for TS3 is from TSR now? Inge, I know your apolitical why can't everyone get along act fools a lot of people, but I just hit my limit. And opposing criminals is a matter of "politics"?

Someone else will just have to develop real tools. Otherwise this community will just be more in thrall to a bunch of dangerous con artists than it already is. Of course, with a lot of so-called leading community members being perfectly willing to work with said con artists, I don't have any hope anyway.

[lorikay]

I know I'm late to the game here.  I haven't even been a sims player for 2 years yet.  However, I found out, less then a year ago about this place and read what TSR has done.  I haven't found anyone to refute what coconut has posted (not that they could), except TSR.  Is there anyone in the free community that believes coconut is manufacturing all of this?  If so, they need to say so and clue us all in.  I believe coconut.  She has evidence.

That being said, if this is politics than TSR has ratfucked this community.

[Quorneater]

However, if you are going to praise the TSR tool on TSR's site, why not also ask Thomas about the links to MTS that he promised in exchange for help with said tool?

I absolutely have done that, on several occasions, in chat   As of about a week or two ago he confirmed that he had instructed his moderators to no longer delete links to MTS.   We thought he had taken far longer than necessary to make the changes, but in the end I and others put the pressure on him to honor his promise.   If for any reason that has still not been implemented in spite of his claims, I can assure you it's not because of silence on my part.

However, just to really post something inflammatory, I would ask everyone to consider the following:   There is no way Peter would have the time, and possibly even the ability, to create something as user-friendly as Workshop.  TSR are paying professional programmers to make their tool and it is being worked on as a full-time job.   This means that some of subscription money they took from us is going back into making something that is free for the community, and better and easier to use than anything the community is willing or able to make for itself at this time.   Like it or not, I think you'll find that the majority of creators both pay and free will switch to using Workshop once the version is out that has all these new features I am testing (NB many of them added at my direct suggestion).  Now I wonder how many anti-TSR players will refuse to download objects made with Workshop, on principle?   You're gonna have to think about boycotting those, if you want to put pressure on people not to support anything TSR does.