Umm...A rant. Sorry.

[Saraswati]

Hey Celligirl

I have to say, I appreciate your passion on this topic.. I actually would love to see you get on MTS and maybe get into running a free site, because even though you're saying you don't understand everything yet, I think if you start running small sites you could probably turn round and help others very effectively.

There's the "worrying about how the site operates thing" and there's the "we all help each other out" thing.. I for one am a regular contributor to MTS, and have been for something like the last year.. (I imagine there's a few of us on here, and lots of people I know help out MTS2). I also contributed about 80 bucks towards Sublime when the donation drive was on, because even though I don't own the site anymore, I love being there and I see it as my home, so I wanted to do what I could.

If we all help out the free sites of whatever size when they genuinely need it, then we get to keep that content free for everyone. And the key is, those kinds of donations ARE optional and if we help when we can if those sites genuinely need it (like Insim right now) then we're not faced with a situation where the free sites ALL dissapear and everyone has to go to Thomas and Peggy for their content.. You'll find over time the fact that we help each other out by doing stuff like sharing hosting, or helping each other with our sites, or giving someone five or ten bucks because they're strugglilng with their hosting is the thing that seperates the free sites and the pay..

Ah, I could keep talking because there was a lot more I wanted to explain.. but I have to go attend to Simmers Against Securom.

Cheers

Kath

[redisenchanted]

I understand your point Celligirl. I much prefer donating to sites that are very clear on their expenses and what they need to keep operating. Nouk's site is a good example of how to run a donation drive properly.

[Amazone]

I understand your point Celligirl. I much prefer donating to sites that are very clear on their expenses and what they need to keep operating. Nouk's site is a good example of how to run a donation drive properly.

you said it. Thanks. I agree 

Edit: in stead of double posting. I see that some free sites also use Zip files, while Rar take up less room on the server.
There are always useful to make some changes to free more space in my opinion.

[Kragey]

I am actually a generous person, in general, and will give readily when I know that my donation is really needed and that it will really be used for what the person or organization asking for it is saying that they need it for. I donate both time and money to several charities such as, for one, Habitat for Humanity. I am admittedly wary, however, of giving to a site if I'm really just supporting someone's hobby. Chalk it up to newness in the community, I suppose.

I don't think it has anything to do with newness to the community and everything to do with the fact that you see no need to be forced in to paying for somebody's hobby, which is perfectly reasonable. My entire religion is basically built around donations and charity, but really, unless I was 95% positive that money would go where it was meant to go and/or if the person needs money to keep doing their hobby (say, they needed $50 for hosting within a month), I wouldn't donate. I'm just not trusting enough for that. And I'm certainly not going to donate if you're basically forcing me to pay just to experience the results of your hobby.

Really, that fits for anything. When I go to a craft show, I don't pay $10 for the actual item that's worth less than $1 retai. I give up those $10 because I want to creator to continue making things.

[scrappysim]

Also, we keep saying that by helping out or donating to a free site that it is supporting "thier" hobby.  I dont see it that way as much as supporting "my" hobby.  My hobby is downloading.  Really.  I enjoy the treasure hunt everyday to see what is new in the community.  There are certain sites that I go to constantly because they have such great stuff that happens to be my taste or style (like piggi's).  If the site owners there followed your model, Celligirl, and decided to close rather than let us know they needed a little help every once in a while, then I would be so dissapointed and sad.  The paysites prove just how much money is changing hands in this community. If each one of us just took the little bit that we feel comfortable with (if you have any extra) and supported the free sites that make the stuff you like the most then we could ensure that those sites continue to be available to all.  Its like casting a vote in favor of freesites and the content you want to keep around.

Like I said, if I thought donating was supporting someone else's hobby then maybe I would feel like you do but since I don't create, I definitely see helping out a freesite as supporting my hobby more than thiers.

[redisenchanted]

If someone can't afford to maintain a free site, there's nothing wrong with asking for help. Right now, I can't really spare the cash to donate to other sites. I'm only saying that if they are specific and open about the costs involved, it's a bit easier.

[Amazone]

I suppose *friends* are helping *friends*. And i suppose many here know each other and help each other out to keep a single site afloat.
I don't know any of these freesite owners, in this society i don't bother to know all of them, i am tired of all the money shit. You don't excatly
want to help out total strangers who asks you for money. Unless it's for charity via organisations i trust. If people want that Peggy hair, they
don't go to freesites and downloading another hair, they want that hair no matter what, that's why we have Peggy's hair in the booty, same
with Rose and stuff from TSR. To make these items available for everybody is the idea behind PMBD. 
Of course i can see the importance of freesites, i really do. And i preciate that many of you have time to create and share it around. And i really encourage people to keep on.

Nouk is Nouk, no matter what, some want her hair, (and leather *snickers*), yes she make more than hair. And they get it for free. I trust both Nouk and MTS2. In my opinion there is no need to donate to other than them, they have most of what people need, and like i said in an earlier post, an excellent alternative
to Rose, Peggy, TSR.

Single siteowners should use RAR files when packing the files, it takes up less space on the server. One can get that program for free too on Cnet. Many are still using zip files. I would do anything to save space if i created Custom Content (CC).

Like Cellgirl i have also a website with graphics, maybe not that heavy, but with high resolution photos, animations and photoshopped stuff. Its a part of my hobby. But i had to switch host, since my site with photos were loading so slow i could go and do the dishes in the meantime.
My new host helped, cause it had more bandwidth, and i still used stylesheets to make it look pretty.

Is it just me or is it just in sims 2 community it has been so common to think it's ok to support fansites with money? I have been in other game communites, why are they not asking for money? Lately i browsed FF7 community, Final Fantasy VII, and they are both meshing and modding, making stuff. They are not asking for a cent or a penny. It's their hobby, and they love to do it. They would go like HUH? if someone started to ask for money to keep on with their hobby. I have also seen a lot of freesites who never ask for support. They handle their own bills. So i will not support anyone else
than Nouks Family and MTS2.

When Insim started to ask for donations, ( i hardly ever go over there), i said, sure, you have made insim, i will help you. While i was boiling inside, cause they have never excatly been nice over there.  It's a Sims 2 thing, you should donate to be a decent person. Is it a part to destroy paysites
to help out single siteowners who's going down? No, not in my opinion. To destroy paysites is to get that damm paysite stuff into the booty
so the payitems can be available for everyone.  Is it a part to destroy paysites to create fresites, yes, i think so.  Since so many freesites do not even think of asking for support, i can't see it as a great loss if someone has to close cause they can't pay for their hobby.

To Cellgirl: A single package is around 300 to 500KB. A set i have with 35 files, is around 5.39MB, that is a kitchen set from a paysite.

It's also very important to create in sims 2 community, and i have often asked myself, are they creating for the players or themself, to get popular?
( i do know some few who are really nice, and create for the fun of it, but never ask for help to a single website).
This is how Sims 2 community has been like. It's not so much for players anymore, it's for those who create and make hacks
to the game, be it freesites or paysites.  I feel that MATY has understood it. JM Pescado seems to know that he's making
hacks for the players, even if he's scary and really don't bother about people, but i've seen others that just want to stroke their egos.

I mentioned the importance to help out with the booty now and then, to donate to PMBD, but was met with hostility. I don't get it.

I am a photographer, an addicted one, and i have bought my own camera, i have paid for my own Photoshop program, and adobe After effects.
I have also bought the program Milkshape, in case... Just in case i started to mesh for sims 2.  I have Bryce, Poser 7,  and some other 3d programs. 
I have bought my own ceasel and oilpaint, i love to draw and paint- since i can't knit, i have other hobbies. Once i tried to knit a sweater to my partner, it came out like a tent. I don't know what's wrong with me and knitting, but it does not fit me. My art, it has something to do with my profession, but i never give out personal information on internet, cause i am "paranoid". If someones freesite is going down because they can't afford to pay the bills, sorry mate, not my table, Pay for your own hobby, like i do, or let your friends help you out.





 

[falln_angel]

If the site owners there followed your model, Celligirl, and decided to close rather than let us know they needed a little help every once in a while, then I would be so dissapointed and sad. 

I don't think Celligirl ever said free sites should never ask for donations, just that she personally wouldn't if she ran one. (She did say that if you're a CC creator and can't afford to run your own Sims fansite, then maybe you should take advantage of MTS2/WNF, but I don't think that's the same thing as telling them to close up shop.)

Okay, I know this is a bit late in the conversation to go back to this, but I've had a really busy day today. (So there!) Glasscigarette mentioned Piggi's Sims earlier today, and how a while back there was a sudden spike in bandwidth usage and they were close to having to shut down. Now, I love Piggi's Sims, I download a ton of stuff from there, and if I'd heard about this at the time I would have helped them out. But at the same time, I have to say that I really don't think they're doing everything they can to decrease the amount of bandwidth they're incurring. The big thing that stands out for me is that I very rarely want more than a handful of recolours (or even just one or two), but the only option is to download the entire set and weed out the ones I don't want. Since a good percentage of these sets have twenty recolours, I end up wasting 75-95% of the bandwidth I'm using nearly every time I download. As much as it's convenient to me, as a downloader, to be able to grab all the files at once, splitting those zip files up would be the first thing I'd do when I noticed my bandwidth usage spiking.
(I'm not trying to pick on Piggi here, just referring to this as one example. I've seen similar things on other sites - clothing meshes being included in every file instead of just linked to, for instance.)

*fake edit*
Luna, if you want I can PM you with a few reasons why that sweater may have turned out so big. I'd post here, but there's been far too much knitting talk in this thread already I think.

And Cala, I think you meant megabytes, not gigabytes. I'm pretty sure my computer would blow up if I tried to play a 48GB lot!

[Amazone]

Yes, would you please!  I can't knit! I have learned to weave, do you know what that is? Maybe i use the wrong word. I can sew, but don't like it.
I made a Toddlerhawk when my daughter was a baby.  I was so proud of it.

To topic: well, it's after all a personal opinion, one can choose to donate to a single site, or skip it. The same goes for MTS2 and Nouks family,
a donation is a donations, it's voluntary. We all know how the paysites use Donations wrong. They can call it payset, cause that's what it really is.

[calalily]

And Cala, I think you meant megabytes, not gigabytes. I'm pretty sure my computer would blow up if I tried to play a 48GB lot!

I did! Will change it now. Thanks. It seemed wrong when I was reading it - but I thought it was just because of the link.

[Anouk]

From all the sites in the WickedNoukFamily, Noukiesims2 uses the most bandwidth. Between 550-650 GB a month. If you go to my site, it's not big. We're there with 6 creators, and most of us use the Compressorizer by Jfade to make stuff smaller. I should pull up some stats and see how we're doing. We all upload stuff to other sites (except for Ira) like Modthesims2, Insimenator, GardenOfShadows, WickedNoukForum,TheSmutResource (not me haha), etc, so the load does get shared with other sites.
A few months ago we started using Wordpress and the website used about 50 gigs a month less.

Even if your website only needs 30 cents a month to stay afloat, I have no problem if you still ask for a donation. I do have a problem if you do not give clarity on what you need and why. If people don't do that, I'm not inclined to donate unless I know you personally.

[Quinctia]

I love you for compressorizing, Nouk.  I can just put your stuff right in the game, unless it's clothes that I have to make available Adult/YA/Elder because I just put Adult clothes on my old sims.

So many sites could save a bit on bandwidth if they'd just fucking COMPRESSORIZE their files.  Some of them go down 2/3rds in size!  The Zip vs. Rar thing is really, really moot compared to the difference that makes.

[Hecubus]

I agree. Compressorizing FTW!

[aikea_guinea]

Another compressorizor fan here! 

Everything on our site is run through the compressorizor before being stuck in a rar.  Still, we've already gone through well over 180GB of bandwidth this month.  While I'm sure this won't be the norm (after all, it's not every month we'll be uploading a year and a half's worth of work all in one go), it helps illustrate that even a single site can go through a lot of bandwidth even when they're careful about their file sizes.  Like those on Nouk's sites, we both also upload sets to GoS once in a while. 

As for Club Crimsyn, our site has actually gotten enough donations to pay for an entire year's worth of hosting at this point.  We considered removing the link entirely, but want to give people the choice of donating to us if they still want to.  Instead, we have a big ol' paragraph about our site being paid for and encourage people to consider donating to other quality free sites instead.   

[Amazone]

The Zip vs. Rar thing is really, really moot compared to the difference that makes.

Well, since i am not an expert on this, i got it from this 100% freesite. I am sure they also use a compressorizor before they make it into a .rar file.
http://www.downtown-sims.com - I saw in their FAQ they didn't want to use zip-files, someone asked them why they didn't.
Tell the owners their argument is Moot. (for some or another reason i dislike that word - *moot*).